VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 Firewall mounted horns

Hello,
My stock firewall mounted horns do not work. Any suggestions? I found the horn relay, it seems and cleaned the contacts. I cleaned the S spring located in the steering wheel. and confirmed the horn wire coming from the steering column, but no sure if the wiring is connected or correct.
Thank you
Michael

The stock horn mounts to the manifold. Do you mean the twin accessory horns that mount to the "V" bar?

Actually neither, must have been some horns added by previous owner. Both go to the three prong horn relay.

Definitely not original but will likely do the job. If the relay is the same as pictured HERE the center lug is power in. The lug on the left goes to the horn(s) and the lug on the right goes to the horn button.

It appears the horn button is not installed then. Left lug(driver side horn), right lug(passenger side horn) and center hot). What we have is an open horn system.
Keep you posted and than you as always

Turned out horns were wired correctly, but no go. How can I confirm continuity from steering wheel to horn relay? I put one meter lead on horn relay and the other on the s spring and depressed, but nothing. I'm not sure where the wire terminates in the steering wheel. My hot lead and horn wires are good so it is either the wire from the steering wheel or the horn relay itself failed.
Thank you
Michael

The wire in the steering colum is never hot, it is a ground wire to complete the circuit. Grounding that terminal externally should cause the horn to work if all else is OK.

Grounding the terminal from the steering wheel will eliminate the horn relay, cool. What I was expecting to find was continuity between the wire and the mechanical portion of the steering wheel. By pressing the horn it must engage something to close the ground loop. I did not see a diagram of the steering wheel horn section as simple as it may be. Thank you for the advice, it is always a help.

The "S" wire horn button can be problematic. It requires the S wire to contact both the steering wheel and the copper ring on the bushing at the same time to complete the circuit. I think what Gene was referring to was to directly ground the lug on the relay that connects to the horn button and see if the horns honk. It doesn't bypass the relay, just the horn button. If the horns honk when you do that but not through the button, the problem is in the horn button/mast jacket bushing & wire set up.

I understood the grounding the relay to eliminate the relay, but you did fill in the gap on how the s wire completes the circuit. Can i access the copper plate inside the steering wheel to see if it oxidized if the relay check good?
Thank you

The wire you need to short to ground is the 1 that goes up to the button on the steering wheel, 2 wires at the relay should have power 1 from the battery and 1 that goes to the button the 3rd wire goes to the horn and gets power when the button wire is grounded.
Tony

That's the point, you're not eliminating the relay. You're testing the relay to see if it's working.

Horn problem solved per instruction. I first jumped the horn button wire to ground and the horns blared-relay good. I removed steering wheel horn grommet hoping to be able to access contact plate only to discover the steering wheel would have to be removed. For the heck of it I removed the grommet and installed the S wire-and the horns blared. Either the horn grommet is incorrect or the S wire is incorrect . It appears the grommet does not allow the S wire to make contact.
Thanks
Michael

A couple of thoughts. The S wire set up can be temperamental, mine was. The wire has to be in just the right position to make the necessary contact. Mine would sometimes honk when I pushed the button on an angle or pushed it to one side or the other.

The first step to resolve the problem would be to turn the button assembly just a tad to where the "legs" of the S wire rub the edge of the holes all the time. If that doesn't solve the problem you can add a dab of solder to the ends of the "legs" to lengthen them. Before going to that extreme I would pull the steering wheel and clean the contact surface of the bushing. Mine was quite dirty.

The problem was so common that there was an accessory one could buy that had a small metal plate that attached to the S wire with a small spring perpendicular to the plate. The spring would be in constant contact with the steering mast so when the S wire leg(s) made contact with the bushing the circuit was easily closed allowing the horn to honk. I made my own since no one makes repops and my horn honking issues are history.

The spring and plate might fix my problem. When insert the s spring and make contact with the mast nut the horn honks. It is as thought the grommet is too tall. I will try to rig something to simulate the spring plate idea.

Tiny
Pulling the steering wheel? I tried your other suggestions so pulling the steering wheel is next. Do I need a puller to remove or is it as simple as remove nut and pull?
Thanks
Michael

PS. I notice by pushing the S wire hard vs pushing the grommet the horn sounds. It is as though the S wire is too short.

I use a harmonic balancer puller. I substitute "J" hooks for the bolts. Spread the hook end of the "J" hooks so that they don't dig into your steering wheel. Hook the "J" hooks under the spokes of your steering wheel and put the screw shaft against the steering mast with the nut at the top so that you don't damage the threads. Get it good & snug then rap the end of the screw shaft with a hammer. The steering wheel should pop loose. The picture I linked shows only using two bolts on the balancer. I use three "J" hooks when using it to pull my steering wheel, one for each spoke.