VCCA Home Forums GENERAL DISCUSSION General Discussions Something is rotten in Denmark (Flint) II

Sorry to see that the thread was closed. What happened to the explanation? :confused:

I hope he changed his mind and will continue to guide this ship. :) :) :)

please reconsider bill. mike

hey bill,

are we on a ship adrift without a captain?..


epi

If this thread was closed, as in censored, will some one please tell me WHO did it & THERE home Address.

Michael41

michael,

if you're wondering about the original "something is rotten..." thread, it was closed by none other than the administrator, bill barker...you can read it here ...


epi

Please read the last posting on the CLOSED thread. I always add an explanation at the end of a thread when it's being closed. If you look at the title of that thread and the title of the new one that I opened, you may notice that I shifted the "tone" of it from being a very negative title to a positive one. Continuing to promote the negativism of that weekend serves no purpose... we need to become positive and begin to look to the future. Hence, my action.

As for your starting comment, I'll explain in a different thread. I still think that the "tone" of our discussions need to shift to being more pro-active.

With due respect, Bill, I think that you "shifted the tone" and closed the thread because there were uncomfortable questions being raised. You've made the decision that the discussion is over, and that now is the time for everyone to come together and find a positive solution that supports your viewpoint. Well, more than half of the Board Members disagree with your viewpoint. Using your power as Chatter administrator to influence opinions on this issue is sort of like what many here have accused Mrs. Fink of doing at the Board meeting. I'd still like to hear from the "eight opposed and two abstain" as to what their reasoning was for their vote. Everyone claims to want the best for the club, but closing the thread and shutting the other side up isn't the way to get it.

They are welcome to respond at any time... and they can open a new thread anytime that they want. But you'll have to admit that with none of them adding any comments to this Board over the last two weeks, that the odds of any of them posting here is going from slim to none.

But if any of them do decide to post, they are more than welcome. Closing down the original thread surely shouldn't stop them. I don't agree with that logic.

Beyond that, I don't understand your other comments, ie "asking the tough questions you didn't want asked". Can you provide examples of what you think are the tough questions that aren't getting asked? I'm sure not aware of any.

Speedline,
I took the closing of the thread in the opposite view. Bill closed a negative thread and opened a possitive one so you or I or anyone else could make a motion or suggestion in a diplomatic way no matter which way we are leaning. In a diplomatic way I mean the way you started your last post, "In due respect", which will generally put a person at ease if you are going to disagree with him. Anyway, like anything else, we have to move forward. :) :)

Well said.....I believe that Bill has been very fair with this matter.I am sure few would (or could) have done as well.This goes for the board members (THAT HAVE RESPONDED) also. :)

Those of us who are on the Board of Directors and who support the needed changes are most responsive to the conversations that have occurred on this issue. We are in discussion daily about ways to initate action that will result in positive changes to our business process and to the management of the VCCA. We are not just sitting around ringing our hands. Please rest assured that we want to accomplish the needed improvements. It will be important for us to get a majority of the board members to support the changes and that is our challenge. Your continued positive comments and support will be of great assistance. One of us will try to post progress when available and appropriate.

Bill Barker made an excellent decision when he closed the previous thread and moved the discussion into a pro-active direction.

Leigh Wilcox
Area III Director

It appears that Bill and some others have their views and reasons for the decision to close the thread. I appreciate their openness, positions and honesty.

For me, I believed Chevy Chat to be an “Open Forum.” I also believed, based on what I had read in the other thread, the views and opinions were contributing to VCCA in many ways. Regardless of the persons' position, comment or statements.

The reason for my comments can be noted in three of MY beliefs & final expressions: 

1. I do NOT know what happened at The Board Meeting.
All I know is someone's perception of that meeting and
what some peoples' views were on what MAY have taken place.

2. There has NEVER been VALUE in stopping communication.

3. Censorship is one of the ugliest forms of power.

Additionally, stopping expression and not supporting conversation causes “closed” and “Flat-loop” conversations . A process in communication that stops ALL interest in responding, contribution, dialogue and understanding.

And understanding ONLY evolve FROM open conversation dialogue. When expression is stopped, understanding is stopped.

And finally, the use of censorship is not the way to treat people. It has ALWAYS failed, even with the best of intentions.

Being a “new” VCCA member, I am not even a blip on the VCCA radar. But for me, the effects of this decision are long running and negative.

In closing, I assure you that I have no preconceived expectations from expressing my views. I do not expect alterations, feed back or conversation or changes.

So, Bill, I could not be more opposed to your decision and actions.

If you care to chat about this issue or my views I may be reached at: kidzatheart@mindspring.com or via phone, Office: 310-543-0524 Pacific Time Zone.

Thank you for this opportunity.
Regards, so long & best of luck,
Michael Welch

Michael 41,

You would do yourself a big favor if you you would re-read the 3 topics again, (in total) before you repost your bloviations.

There is a BIG difference between censorship and redirection. Bill has done a wonderful job working with the limited tools provided him!

The glass is at least half full, how do you see it??

Respectfull submitted,

Oliver Smith

I read the entire process and every entry, I believe.

And I DID NOT question Bill's job performance. Thus I would suggest you re-read my note.

There's not one single issues pertaining to Bill or any one else's job performance. My gripe is as stated, Censorship.

I can and did REMOVE the "man" from the action. Easy to do if you do NOT personalize the comments.

And my glass is and always has been 1/2 full. It's how I see I live life but NOT I measure censorship Oliver.

And if there's was no censorship, and I'm incorrect in my view of the issues, I will openly readdress the issue.

But I do not have to apologize for stating my view. Ever. But as I see and experienced the event, it took place. And I am against the PRACTICE of CENSORSHIP.

And more Truth is I sent Bill a note over 4 months ago, complimenting his responsibilities on this site. Have you ??

Furthermore I never questioned or JUDGED any one views, ONLY their actions. And if it is done with respect and dignity it is ok in my book. And it is a learning experience for both sides of an issue, if they remain OPEN.

As I said, CENSORSHIP is an UGLY ACTION, in MY OPINION.

If it's not then go back to the thread and find the value in every entry, and list them as I did, with out prejudice or judgment,
I came up with 79 bright, understanding thoughts and ideas that could be tabled, from both sides of the isle.

And if I use the logic presented here, and I buy a nice 1955 Chevy that's good judgement. But if I paint it bright Purple I am, what ? A jerk. Got to remove the man from the action, or none of us would have value.

As I stated Oliver, there is VALUE in expression and dialogue but not in censorship.

With continued respect,
Michael

Would still like to see an answer to my previous question.

--Bill