VCCA Home Forums GENERAL DISCUSSION Forum Questions Inquiring not Bashing

VCCA states the the vehicle must be 25 years old or older. That is straight from Bill Bradford. One main reason I'm asking all these questions is because I would like to start a VCCA region here in Louisiana since we do not have one. I know a car club here with over 120 members and lots of antique Chevrolets. My main concern is this. They have quite a few members whose vehicles are bone stock outside but have new engines and tranmissions for long distance shows and meets. According to VCCA policy this is not an acceptable car that could be judged at a VCCA meet. :confused:

Whoa, I have to say it but since this post we have had the most people in the forum today.... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

MrMack you have been a great help to me on questions I have asked you before. I'm not asking anybody in the VCCA to change their ways or believes in restoring vehicles. I'm saying that there are other proud Chevrolet owners just like all of you who want to be a part of this organization and be just as big a part of it as all of you are. I think this is a great organization but from 1961 to 2002 it seems such a loss that all Chevrolet owners can't be part of you. You guys have to remember you are the VCCA looking out, I am on the outside looking in.

Excellent summary. Maybe you guys will let me borrow the two previous responses that are posted just ahead of this note, to end the next threaded discussion that gets wrapped up in a dilogue of hotrods verses vintage.

This forum has been up for approximately 90 days and this is the second long-winded discussion on this topic... maybe I should create a new forum titled "hotrods"??? huh?

Seriously, it's a great discussion and it's especially great when the conclusion is that everyone has an affinity for Chevys and in order to get maximum enjoyment out of them, you may have to belong to multiple clubs. Nothing wrong with that.

I'm not going to end this thread yet, but I don't see much value in it continuing - however, that's up to you-all. I noticed earlier this evening that when 14 people were logged on, that only three of them were in this forum and the other 11 were reading, and responding, to other car and parts discussions. For my money, that's where I'm going to spend my time in the future. Whether you're rodding or maintaining vintage, you need info and parts and that's what this forum is for.

Go for it (but keep it civil)! Thanks.

Thanks guys for all the input. You have answered what I was needing to know. However, I am open to suggestions or comments from anyone. You can e-mail me at streatrd@aol.com

:) :p :)

Mmmmmm...... super interesting there people. :)

Chevy lovers, Maybe there is a way both groups can do better, Vcca has a great organization and there are many Street rodders restora-rod owners out there, The Sourhern California Region shows (whether sponsered by VCCA or not I don't know )have had both modified and stock classes, I am not suggesting that one club must give in to the other, BUT maybe we could have some dialog in other regions that hurt for entrys, and have some joint sponsered shows, and have informal classes of each, and use a combination of club members and a popular vote by participants and the audiance to award some trophys of medals, just to break the ice and foster better relations between the groups, What do you think?

I already have an antique tractor and engine club, currently with 72 active members. My website is www.aatandec.50megs.com if you want to check it out. I have been asked to start a car club and I am thinking on doing that also. I am also trying to get you guys The VCCA going in Louisiana since there is no region established here. That was the main reason for my posting so many inquiries in this thread. The big dilema I have run into is this. We already have a ton of extremely large car clubs here. They accept all cars whether they are stock or modified. We also have a large number of Make only clubs such as Chevy, Ford, Mopar and so on, just like VCCA. The deal with the make only clubs here is that they also accept stock and modified cars. If MrMack wants to start a club I'd be more than happy to get a Louisiana and Texas club going.

Hokay MB, could maybe we hold our first meeting over at Beau Bridge, and take on a few of them delighful litte whiskered crustaceous critters?

Heck Mack we don't have to go to Breaux Bridge for crawfish. I can boil those suckers right here at the house for you. Since some of the family are Crawfisherman, I'll get us a better deal per pound.

:eek: :eek: :eek:

M.B. xcuse me for leaving the X off of Beaux, I just been away from that area too long. I worked the Lafayette, New Iberia and Houma area a lot before I retired from Halliburton in 1997, I should have met you sooner!

No problem, lol...I know Halliburton real well. I used to install Global positioning systems on the offshore boats for the Dynamic Positioning Systems. I've been on quite a few rig handlers and frak boats.

hi guy's im new on this site and just would like to say something about what i have read so take it for what it is and or don't.

i have owned sevrel old chevy's i have never even thought about owning anything else.But at the same time one of the cars i have owned was a 56 chevy that was a car that had cought on fire. we got it out soon after it had started but the car was so bad off that we could not justify the money that it would have taken to rebuild it to the "restored state" i own a 56 four door bel-air now and it is in all factory stock condition on every part of the car but the paint as it was repainted 4 years after it was bought. to a diffrent color. so dose this mean that due to this my car is no longer a classic chevy? I would have to say no. but there are some folks that would say yes do to the paint being a diffrent shade of blue then the factory painted it. but yet i have had the car juged by folks who do this all the time and not once in two years have i ever been asked why it was repainted. the point that im trying to make is that there are alot of folks who love the classiccars but they like them in diffrent ways and there are alot of the old chevys that have diffrent motors in them like the 327 instead of the factory 283 or the 265 . dose this mean that they are not welcome in this club because they are not in the same class as you are with the "orginal" to be honest if you want to get really serious about being orignal you all have some thing to look a t due to the fact that starters fail,batteries fail, etc.. parts wear out and pepole change them so unless you have a car that some one has bought and brang home then parked it for the last 50 years then none of the cars are "factory stock" i have to say i do agree with mudbug as there should be a class for street rodders and i dont think that any one should hate some one over what they think that the car they own should look like as a restored car.i was once told that the term restored ment: to bring a car back to its orginal state, back to factory condition and to make it like the day it came off the [bleeped]. line. and the trem restrofide: means to bring a car to a standard of safe operation. now i have the 56 i have now and it it will be for the most part a orginal car. but for the time being the car is going to be in primmer .Due to me and my wife being in the service . i dont want to worrie about some one messing up a paint job that i have worked long and hard to achive. so by doing this that car will be what most pepole would call a retro rod. so i guess by doing this i would not fit in to this clubs ideas of what a car should be. to be honest i think that if you guys dont see the point he is trying to make then you are shorting your selves i have seen alot of classic that i dont like the way the person has built them but at the same time they are still a classic.
this is all i have to say sorry so long winded but you wnt hear from me any more as i dontthink that your club would fit in to the standards i hold for my self or my cars. i have had a lot of fun being part of the classicchevy worl and enjoy ever day going out to mine and knowing iown a peice of american history that not manny pepole can say they do. and thank you chevy for all that you have one for us as restoers, street roders, one last statemnt
street rodders are americas first recyclers!

Mickey, a paint job does not disqualify a car from being judged, but if the color is different than shown on the trim plate it would drop some points, and the same thing with the engine, if it is the same year it will not drop as many points than if it was a newer model engine. just like a set of radial tires that are not available when the car was built won't disqualify your car from being judges but will drop some points, also if your car has caked on grease and dirt on the undercarriage will drop points, like anything that was not on the car when it rolled out of the factory. However if you don't have a fire extingusher inside the passenger area within reach of the driver WILL DISQUALIFY your car from being on the judgeing field!

Just a couple of words, Street rodding may take some of the parts available to restorers out of circulation and also drive up the prices, 2nd why recycle when you can rebuild, 3rd why not think about belonging to more than one club, VCCA members that don't street rod don't need to go else where but folks like myself go both ways can always join another club in addition to VCCA, and many of us do, that way we don't have to put up with all the arguments and have to persuade someone else to gome to our point of view, if it makes you angry to associate with VCCA folks don't put VCCA.org on your favorites list, and visa-versa!

Someone said that If you are a VCCA member and would like a change then the idea is to submit a motion to your Area Board member of which it will be reviewed.
Question on this. Whats the procedure for International Members? Does the VCCA have area board members to represent the International members?
Steve

A message to Mickey,

Mickey, it would be a real shame if you allowed the preceeding discussion to turn you away from the VCCA. What you witnessed above is a Membership trying to grapple with their mission statement, "Dedicated to the Preservation and Restoration of Chevrolets," and just how to interpret and police whose words. The very democratic principals that you and your wife are defending. I would urge you to stick around.

MrMack is correct, the condition of your paint, or the lack of its authenticity should not exclude your vehicle from the VCCA judging field, nor should a non-original battery, fuel filter or whatever item that was changed over the years to allow the vehicle to remain functional. You just have to be willing to accept the point deduction that might result. If all vehicles on the judging field were exactly correct, the whole reason for judging would be lost. Many of the things we argue about while judging vehicles, (no one has a market on the correct answer) time and the loss of documentation has reduced our ability to be 100% sure of what is correct. I have a vehicle that I restored that isn't totally correct in all areas, but I keep trying to get it there, but probably will never be totally successful. In the 40th Anniversary issue of the G & D, I can point out show winning vehicles that have items that are incorrect. My whole point here is that we (the VCCA) are not perfect and we never will be.

Once again, I would urge you to re-think your decision. In the big picture, we're not all bad.

This subject isn't new - or complicated. I'm sure the founders of this club thought about the VCCA mission statement before they put it to paper, and it was no mistake that they came up with the words preservation and restoration. We have judging guidelines to help us understand what those words mean. To characterize those of us who agree with these rules as hateful, or bad, or undemocratic is just plain false.

SPEEDLINE

i see both sides of the topic you have but i also have been around alot of clubs that have not change or bend the rules or allow others to be around them and i have also seen theses same clubs lose intrest. on that i can think of that was recent was a tri five club all of the mebers would allow any car as long as it was a tri five chevy but when thier charter started to allow the other years from 55-72 they lost the club in that area due to the folks who wolud not bend or allow the others to join. they lost the charter they had and tried for awhile to get a club going of thier own but they are no longer around and now the only club in that town or area is a 50 truck for the meetings due to the lack of intrest the charter combined three clubs to make one. i think that if i had a club i was in charge of i would look real seriouuse at allowing it to go to a vote for allowing judging and admitance of street roders. my god folks even the constitution has things called admendments in it. they are there for a reason my car is one of the things i hold dear to my heat other them the loving wife i have and the three kids i have and you know if one of them was do something i dont really like i dont band them from being around me or my house. i actsept it and move on i still love the person even if i dont like the things they do all the time they are still my blood. so even if i were to judge with you i would have to agree to take the point loss that is fine but i would also expect you to treat my car as if it was one of your own after all it is stil a g.m product weather i repaint it , change the tires or the wheels. most folks who have street rods know that they will be juged by a diffrent set of ruls. that is why alot of clubs out there have rules for street rodders to follow. like the three changes rule if you change more then three things then you get put in to a diffrent class. that is so they are juged by thier peers agains others of the same type of cars/truck?? i have not gave up on you but like i said in the last post i see mud bugs point as i have had been judge in both classes on the cars i have owned. and i did not fear that when i went in to it i knew it was that was and i expected to be apart of that club. i think if you folks would learn to bend alittel your club would not choke it's own life out ! i do agree that some cars are ment to go back to factory but some are way to far gone to "rebuild" i have done body work for years on and off and have seen cars that even the most hard core restore in the world would not look at as anything other then a parts car but after we got done with it they were more then willing to buy it from us. i think that you could have a place for all chevy's cars dont die unless you let them even if you dont go stock they are still a chevy. and i guess the thing im looking at is you have shut the idea down before you thought about it. not saying you have to change your club but think about maybe opening a diffrent chapter of it for street rods and write some rules that they could approve and learn to enjoy all of the club as a part of the main core vcca. also you have to think of this most of the guys that are in car clubs for the most part have ethier grown up in the era of there cars or have grown up in a family that had a old car when i was younger i had to restor my first car i almost didnt finish it because i could not grow to like a cra the was nasty looking yello and black but you know i did finish it but i almost never wanted to look at another car but i had a love of cars and would for no one give that up and now i see why the car was more valueabl as a restored or rebuilt classic. but i have also grown up alot in the years between that car and this one. and i love a car that is stock in evrey way but i also like the cars that folks have taken the time and money to fabricat thing to them think of it this way anyone can get a tool and pull something apart but it takes a person with talent and alot of time to build something from scratch or real close to it. there are a verry few pepol in this worl in truth that will go out and buy a car like you have and take it home and cut it apart just so that they had a custom car. most of them could not do it anyway and make the car worth keeping afterwards. just a thought! :) :)

Sorry for being a later comer to this thread. I was at the VCCA National Board Meeting. It is true that some members feel that street rodders are not welcome in the VCCA. Fortunately it is not the case for the many of the members. It is also true that there are likely no truly original (non-modified) old Chevrolets. Most have had some parts replaced. Even NOS parts purchased directly from Chevrolet dealers may not be the exact replacement as originally installed at the factory.

It is also true that you don't need to own a Chevrolet to join the VCCA. We have members who do not currently own and old Chevrolet or any Chevrolet for that matter. They are still members of the VCCA and the San Jacinto Region. In fact most of our members have Chevrolets that have some "improvements" added over the years.

When it comes to judging, which most members will never have done, they will likely loose points for some of the non original parts. I say some because they will not see all of them.

We have had tours with cars (& trucks) that had non original engines and other parts. They often did not return for other tours for some reason. I don't know exactly why but suspect they felt out of place 'cause they didn't have any break downs, didn't overheat, or felt frustrated with the slow speed. It is just a different feeling to have taken a 70+ year old vehicle that is basically like it was when built and try to drive it over modern roadways (and sometimes on roads similar to those when new [dirt and holes and mud] without problems. That is problems other than getting hot (no air conditioning), bounced (poor suspension), vibrated (unbalanced engine), etc. It is a challange and there is a sense of accomplishment in completing the days touring. It is also a challange to help fix the cars of those not so fortunate.

To conclude I feel that many in the VCCA feel that they are trying to preserve a part of history. They are trying to preserve Vintage Chevrolets to appear as they did when originally built and also enjoy being able to drive them. Others just like Chevrolets. They all have something in common and enjoy associating with others who appreciate what Chevrolet has meant over the years. Our red blood cells are bow-tie shaped!!!

Well said, Chip! I don't care if you own a street rod, tank or jet, you can join the VCCA. The VCCA is about history. Preservation and restoration of an automobile produced at least 25 years ago. Members do everything they can to discover the original colors, parts, accessories, construction techniques, etc. of the cars so that during the restoration process there is a place where other members can go to get good advice about their project. To support that goal we hold meets where you can get your car judged by, supposedly, well trained club members who will let you know what is correct and incorrect about your car. The idea is that you are trying to replicate an original, fresh-from-the-factory automobile. The judge is helping you to do that, it's not a popularity contest. You then take your car home and use the judges report to make changes to your car to make it original.

Eventually you will have a car that is as close as you can get to the original and when you drive your car down an old country lane on a warm sunny day with a bunch of other original cars, you may just get the feel of what was like to be alive way back when….

Now as to your desire to rod your old car. There is a finite number of those old cars in the world. No more are being made. Every year some are rodded, which reduces the number of original cars out in the world. Eventually there will not be any original cars out there, because every year several were rodded. To the VCCA that is a bad thing. We can take a weather beaten car and restore it to near new condition but we can't take a cut up, parted out rod and do anything with it.

So, do we hate rods? No, some are quite interesting, all are unique but no two look alike. The reason is that everyone who wants a rod wants something different, something that reflects his or her tastes. We may mourn the loss of another automobile but we also know that you could make your rod out of anything, include fiberglass replicas. Maybe in your case the car was just too far-gone to be fully restored, but then again, maybe it wasn't….

Can you join the VCCA? Sure, we're glad to have you! You may be the guy who can help us solve a paint technique problem or some other question we have about the restoration process. Can you have your car judged? Why? You didn't even try to restore the car. You already know that nothing about your car is original and the judge isn't supposed to be interested in how pretty it is, so what would be your motivation? If your interested in a popularity contest, there are rod oriented clubs that would love to look at your car.

Brian

Brian, Thanks for making several good points on
restoration vs. rods. I agree completely. Turning
an antique into a street rod is like saying the
way Chevrolet made it wasn't good enough. If you
can't accept the cars we like you may find you are
not completely accepted in the VCCA. And I don't
buy the idea that restoration costs a lot more
than building a rod. A well engineered street rod
project could be very costly. And if you say you
can't get the parts for a restoration - I think
you haven't done your homework.

Well put Brian. I've been watching this thread for awhile and this topic is not a new one. VCCA is for preserving the history of Chevrolet. The greatest joy of this club is attending a meet and being able to see everything from a Forerunner to a Camaro SS with a big-block and chambered exhaust! And the best part is they are all very close to the way they came out of the factory. Chevrolet made a year, a model for everyone's taste. This is a great club and it's members have a wealth of information on the history of Chevrolet.

Go to www.ephemeranow.com/cars/cars074.htm

I agree totally with that picture since the broken down car is a 32 Ford Roadster.

Now since I started this thread I'd like to make some comments since we have gotten more replies on it. First of all, I like all antique Chevy's rather they are original or streetrodded. I will disagree on one thing I have heard and that is the fact that once a car has be modified it can't be put back original. The hardest part is modifying a vehicles appearance, every car can be changed back to its former state with the right body man and machine shop. Owners do not change a car because Chevrolet didn't make it good enough. If Chevrolet did not make it good enough they would go with a different make. People modify cars for the same reason today as they did since they first rolled off the showroom floors many years ago. They change them because they want to and because they own them. I can't name a single living soul right now that does not go out and buy a new vehicle and not change something that did not originally come on or with the vehicle. We suit our cars to our taste and our likings, that's it; nothing else. Louis Chevrolet himself did not want to sell Chevrolet cars with the Chevrolet name in 1911. He was a swiss born race car driver who built totally unaffordable cars to the general public. His first vehicles were more expensive than a Cadillac at the time. Mr. William C. Durant came along and partnered with him and put the Chevrolet name on the cars to his disatisfaction. He wanted to sell the premium cars instead. Mr. Louis Chevrolet left in 1914 and was nothing more than an assembly line worker at retirement. The point is that no one is saying the car was not good enough, they are saying this is how I like my car. More than half the stories I get from other people is this. I'm sure glad that guy streetrodded his old car because I needed the engine, tranny and frame. I have never met any man who scraps what he takes off of a car. If he does then shame on him. I'll tell you this guys. I rather see any vehicle streetrodded than rotting in a field or going to the scrap yard. Now I also like my originals and here is my belief on that. I could never find all my original parts if it was not for some streetrodders willing to sale the parts they no longer need. I much rather see everyone working together and salvaging them either way than arguing over which way they think is the most ethical. The most ethical way to restore a car is the way the owner likes it and that is all it boils down to. ( Personal Preference )