VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 216 timing gear oiling

Group,

I have the timing cover off of my 38 216 to replace the front main seal and I have a question about the oiling of the timing gears.. What is the best way to check that the oil passage for the timing gears is clear? I plan on opening up the orifice to 1/8" is there anything else I should do/check while I have this apart?

Thanks,
Matt

If you were so inclined, you could pull the distributor and run the oil pump with a drill. If it's clear you should see it squirting then.

The oil pump shaft is like a really big flat screw head at the bottom of the distributor. I believe I used a 3/8 lag bolt and ground the head to make a straight screwdriver end. Worked like a champ. And don't toss it as you'll likely use it again.

I broke the handle off of a cheap big screwdriver to make my oil pump driver. The shank diameter was around 3/8”. I did have the grind some width off of the tip.

I agree with Skidplate’s suggestion. While you are running the pump check the oil delivery to the rocker arms.

I had thought of it but unfortunately i have the oil pan off. Yes I do have an old screw driver that i did this to to prime the system a couple years ago.

Do either of you know if timing gears are fed with oil from the cam/crankshaft oil supply (pressurized) or is it splash oil?

Also when i re-install the oil orifice should I use something like blue loctite? Thread sealer?

Thanks,
Matt

I'm going to say the timing gears are splash but don't go by me. Just a guess. As for lock or seal? I really doubt it matters.

If this oiling question is a big concern to you though (and I'm going to assume it is) the oil pan doesn't have to be a sealed unit for the pump to distribute oil throughout the engine. You could just lay the pan up in place with four of the numerous oil pan screws, ad your oil and pump away.

When I did mine, because my intent was to confirm as much as possible that all my journals were clear, I actually pumped Marvel Mystery Oil instead of oil. I figured it certainly wouldn't hurt and since MMO is (I'm assuming) some type of super high detergent, it might even help a little.

And I definitely second on Rusty's comment on checking your top end for good oil distribution. You'll never get a better opportunity.

Then after all was confirmed to be flowing as it should and I buttoned everything up (except for the distributor) then I just put in my required amount of engine oil and ran the pump again until all was nicely preoiled and ready for startup. I dropped in my distributor and off we went... so to speak.

On another note, since you have the oil pan off, you may want to Plasti-gauge all your mains and, if need be, take a shim or two out to tighten them up. I had to order the plastigauge special because no one local had that fine a tolerance, but it did pay off. They were indeed on the sloppy side.

I should clarify; this was on my 37 straight 8 Buick but I'm going to assume both are mostly the same.

Gravity feeds oil to the time gears. It is the excess oil that comes out of the front camshaft bearing. The cam bearings are fed pressurized oil similar to the main bearings. Once the oil comes out of the front cam bearing it is no longer under pressure.

The only way I know to confirm that the milled passage is really clean and clear is to remove the front plate from the face of the block. That milled slot gets filled up with sludge. Opening the orifice does not help if oil cannot get through the slot.

You might see some oil if you run the pump with a drill like we have been discussing.

Be careful using Plastigage on the main bearings if the engine is in the vehicle. You actually have to push the crank up into the block to get a good reading. Otherwise the weight of the crank squeezes the Plastigage and you think you have very small clearances. The “resistance to rotation” method in the shop manual actually works quite well.

X2

On a pre 1949 engine the riming gears get oiled from what passes by the front camshaft bearing.
This oil will fill the passage milled into the front mounting plate. Cold oil will barely pass through the tiny opening in the nozzel. The oil is fed by graity. The passage is usually filled with sludge,

Thanks for all the information.

I have already verified that I have good oil flow to the rockers.

When i purchased the car had been sitting for 10-12 years and i spent a lot of time verifying the engine before firing it up. It appears to have been gone through not long ago. The engine is pretty clean, no sludge.

Thanks,
Matt

Regarding the main bearing clearance check, I use small strips of .001 and .002" shim stock to determine the clearance. I just lay it across the bearing. bolt it up and check for binding. When there is no clearance the crankshaft is locked up.

"You actually have to push the crank up into the block to get a good reading"

Assuming it's a working engine and the the crank is in place. You check them one at a time and retorque each one as you go, wouldn't that avoid any crack sag?

Correction "Crank Sag" not "Crack Sag". That's a different problem all together.

. I wanted to get a picture of the situation so I looked for an engine with the timing gear cover off. In the far corner, at the bottom of the pile, there it was, a 1941 - 51 engine with out the cover. Best I could do is stick my arm down and click till I got a photo. .
. First photo show tight quarters. Second photo shows the little tube that squirts oil on the timing gears. Passenger cars have fiber large gears. Corvette and trucks have aluminum large gears. .
. . Lou
.

here are pics of the timing gear oiling

the hole in the block just goes to the crankcase and you can see it from under the car is the oil pan is off

I've seen a lot that were a pinched piece of tubing. My 38 has a brass fitting with a small drilled hole. I enlarged mine a bit.

Mine has the brass fitting and I will enlarge the opening to 1/8"