VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 Having trouble staying running

All, I could use some helpful advice. I have a '38 PU with original 216 running a W-1 Carter carb. Just started having issues. It will start with no problem and idle perfect. When I take off down the road it will kill on me after 2-3 miles. When I try to restart it will start with the choke pulled but will die soon after. Came home and cleaned the carb and found the cork gasket(I guess that's what its called) at the top of the bowl was broken apart. So I cleaned it real good and put me a new gasket and then put the carb back together. It again idled perfect and got down the road at ~3-4 miles it killed on me again. It did not have any issues while running until it killed. Does anyone have any idea what to check next? I am thinking of changing the inline fuel filter and and/or maybe the fuel filter and will possibly pull apart the carburetor again.

More info....Recently had replaced a few bent push rods in it. While I was in there I adjusted the valve lash on my valves. It had been sitting up for a few months so I probably had some bad gas. After I repaired the push rods I syphoned all the gas out and replaced with fresh gas.

Again any helpful advice would be appreciated..

If it were mine I would remove the gas tank and have it cleaned. Blow out the gas lines and flush out the fuel pump.

I would suggest changing the fuel filter; then a test drive with the cap left off of the fuel tank.

If this fixes the issue, put the cap back on. If still fixed, carry a spare fuel filter. If this doesn't fix the issue, reread Gene's post above mine.

Jon.

Ok. I’ve done this when I first bought the truck...roughly 7 years ago, the guys at the radiator shop said that it was hard to clean because it had a baffle in it. But it may be time to do it again. Thanks.

My 37 PU did the same thing. Found a bee in the gas line just before the pump.

Lol. A bee?? That’s funny. I’ll go through my gas lines. Sounds like that’s my issue.

I agree that it sounds like a fuel starvation problem. Jon's suggestion to drive with the fuel cap off is the first step I would try. It's simple and could be your problem if the vent in the fuel cap is plugged.

The reality is that the most likely scenario is crud in the fuel tank. It happens to almost all of us and the only real cure is removing and cleaning the tank or even replacing it. And it does get into the lines.

You mention changing a fuel filter. Where is it in the circuit?

I had similar experience a while back. When doing some engine work I had removed the carb and set it on a shelf. Don't remember how long it sat but after reinstalling I could not get the engine to run unless I primed the carb. Took line from pump to carb off and had plenty of gas coming there. Took top off carb and bowl was dry. I found an earwig (type of insect) had made a home in the inlet fitting of the carb.

Dick

I have an inline fuel filter just before the fuel pump.

Is the filter the metal canister type that you can't see thru ?? If so it might be plugged with debris so try a new one that you can see into.

Dick

Yes it is a metal one. I have purchased a see through one and will install it in the next day or so. When I do that I will blow through all the gas lines to make sure they are clear also.

I use a Fram G2 filter at the tank outlet on my '37. I like it because it has a clear plastic housing so I can see when it starts getting full of the fine rust particles from my tank. I do have a shutoff valve between the filter and the tank so it is not very messy to change.

I prefer having a filter between the tank and the fuel pump like your set-up. There are some differences of opinion that perhaps it should be between the pump and the carburetor. The main concern is that the fuel pump has limited suction capability. Even a new clean filter does add some restriction on the inlet side of the fuel pump. This could cause problems especially under hot start conditions.

I have not had any indications of problems with my set-up. In fact the only problem I have noticed is that the car will not accelerate as well when the filter gets really full. Which is exactly what I want to happen rather than have all that crud go trough the fuel pump.

I agree. I've had this discussion a few times with some buddys. The filter was setup before I bought the truck and it hasn't given me any trouble until now. I'm hesitant to install another one between the pump and carburetor because I'd hate to have another leak point. My old girl already has enough minor leaks in my shed already. LOL Plus I'm not too crazy about the look of a new filter in an old setup like that. If there was a space for me to kind of hide it so it can't be seen when I go to car shows I may do it.

But to have one right out the tank with a cutoff valve is a good idea. I'll look into that as well.

Thanks again to everyone.

In a different lifetime (well, 40 plus years ago), and Carter had not yet been purchased by Federal Mogul, we were distributors for Carter.

Because there was a demand, we sold the little Carter "Gerotor" electric fuel pumps. These were offered in a couple of different pressures, and would run on either 6 or 12 volts. Interestingly enough, after F/M purchased Carter, F/M still sold the exact same pumps but they were no longer rated at 6/12 volts; only 12 volts.

Once in awhile, we would get a pump that came back after only a week or two. These were completely locked up, wouldn't turn. Took a hacksaw to one, and found rust particles had locked it up. Sent the pump to a friend in Carter Engineering for their inspection. The next order of pumps we received from Carter had an inline filter installed on the inlet side of the pump. Guess we weren't the only distributor with the problem.

The point to the above being that Carter Engineering felt that a filter on the inlet side of the pump was OK, which is good enough for me.

Jon.

Great information Jon.

I was referring to the suction side of the regular diaphragm fuel pump as sometimes being suspect that it could pull through a filter. As I stated, I have not had any issues expect when the filter gets really plugged. Which is the desired behavior from my view.

I do not think a filter between the pump and carburetor is necessary if you have a good one at the tank. Plus the combination of 2 filters might start to be more restrictive than you would like.

So a little update, I put a new see through fuel filter inline and blew through all my fuel lines. Put everything back together and she started right up. Woke up the next morning and pulled her out and cleaned her up good. She ran good in my yard so I loaded her up in my trailer and drove that evening to my hotel for the car show the next day. I woke that morning and she started right up off the trailer and I turned 1 corner and she died again. As I looked at the fuel lines again I quickly saw the culprit. Looks like the diaphragm in my fuel pump is messed up and not keeping prime. This was the only thing I didn’t touch on the fuel system. Should have seen it earlier as I have the bowl type mechanical fuel pump. Anyways, I have a new one ordered along with a rebuild kit for mine so I’ll have a spare in hand always. Again thanks for all the helpful advice and information. I benefit greatly as a “newbie” on the mechanical side.

Sorry to hear that things did not go as planned. My best guess is that the diaphragm was damaged by all the dirt and particles passing through the fuel pump. That is reason I prefer a filter the between the tank and pump.

When you rebuild the fuel pump make sure you get the check valves in the proper orientation and seated well in the housing.

The pump I rebuilt failed after about 1200 miles when one of the check valves came out of the pump housing. I determined that the outside diameter of the check valve was slightly small. It is a simple steel stamped part. I used a deep well socket to slightly enlarge the open end of the stamping. It fit much tighter into the pump housing. It is operating fine now.

Keep an eye on the see thru filter as it does not take a lot of crud to plug it. The suction will pull the crud against the outlet side screen and cut off the flow. Once the suction stops the crud will now settle to the bottom and the car will start and run again for a short time. If you can see any crud in the filter it's best to remove and clean (if serviceable type) .

Thanks for the tip. Will do.

Great tip, it seems like I did see a little crude in there at the beginning but it was late at night and I looked the next day and didn't notice anything. It may be clogged again not letting fuel to my pump. Thanks again I'll pull it off again and check it. I still plan to either buy a new gas tank or at least remove mine again and try to have it cleaned again. I am having issues trying to find a replacement tank for a '38 Chevy truck. I found plenty for the cars but I don't think they are th esame.