VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND NEWER 1958-1960 Value of Vintage Paint - How to Touch-up?

I have a 58 Bel Air inherited 3 yrs ago that I've waited all my life to own. It has 34K orig. mi. on the odometer and was kept garaged. The garage did not protect the paint perfectly, as Grandma wasn't much on cosmetic maintenance so wax is a new concept to this thinning finish.

http://home.comcast.net/~ps_kennedy/wsb/media/342430/site1018.jpg

We're going to pull the motor to recondition and detail it soon, so I want to spruce up the ouside in a few spots while I'm at it.

I priced a high-end repaint (not in budget) but also have read that original paint in good condition adds to the car's value. So what's the best advice - save up for bead blast and total repaint, or keep it original as a "survivor"?

It's still a beauty even inside of 5 feet, with eye glasses on in broad daylight, so if it's possible to get a close matching lacquer to do touch ups I'd prefer that but I'd need to know where to get the old style paint.

Suggestions?

I think I would do a nice cleanup, maybe a light extra fine once over with some white polishing compound, by hand, then with a good wax, and hand buffing you may be surprised what appears. An all day effort isn't that unpleasant of a deal. The better the car will start to look will encourage you to do more, at least it does me.

Professional detailers sometimes can come up with a fine job, but it may be expensive, but nothing like a re-painting.
As for getting a touch up done, I wouldn't worry about the original paint, it may be hard to locate, because of EPA rules. what is needed cover scratches? or the top of hood, fenders & trunk? I had a dent removed and repainted on a 53, a local collision repair shop used base coat, clear coat and it is undetectable from the old laquer. It was not too costly. I had to buy a Quart of color base coat, computer matched to the car and the total bill was $300 for a cup sized dent on top of a rear fender. Don't ask me how it got there, it is something I rather would not disclose. :(

Before doing anything drastic such as a repaint or engine overhaul, always keep telling yourself," a vehicle is only original once." Once it's repainted, overhauled, etc., it is no longer "original" in the sense. More and more people are discovering the value in true survivors.

Try a product like Meguiars Show Car Glaze followed with a good Carnuba wax. You may be surprised at how well it looks.

Your 58 looks like a beaut. I'd think long and hard before repainting, especially since a "quality" repaint could easily cost $5000-$10,000. But in the long run, it's your car, do as you see fit.

Quick question, with only 34K on it, why are you reconditioning the engine?

Bob

I've had good results using 3M Finesse-it II. Doesn't contain silicone or wax. Designed for use on all paints to remove grade microfine 1500 or finer scratches or light oxidation...

Thanks everyone for all the input. I've done a full rub-out, polish and wax and have kept it detailed for the time I've had it. The first photo is an "after" detailing shot. Here is the "before":

http://home.comcast.net/~ps_kennedy/wsb/media/342430/site1.jpg

The baseline detail job was done in 2003 at the shop that got it tuned and road-ready for us. He did a good job, but when he buffed down through the oxidation to get to the shiny paint, it got to a few spots where there isn't much paint left, like on the brows over the headlights and ridges of the fenders.

What we're looking to cover with a matching color is a few spots where surface rust is starting to show through and where paint is scraped off along the edge of the wheel well, about 1/2" wide by 4" long where Grandma got too close to the doorframe of her one car garage. No real damage to the steel, so a light sanding, primer and touch-up should get it looking nice.

I see one spot on top of the left quarter that looks like it was touched up with enamel over the lacquer, probably where the flip-up garage door fell on it if the neighbor's story is accurate, and it's not a great paint blend so I can see why everyone says it's not the best option. The painter I talked to also pointed out that the epoxy primer they use under the enamel is going to be harder than the lacquer paint, so it has to go down to bare metal to protect it properly.

With the motor, it's still running strong but it's got virtually no paint left on the valve covers, plus I want to address the exhaust blow-by and improve the gasket sealing surfaces. My wife wants it to stop making a mess on the drip pans and driveway. I'm in tight with Mr. Goodwrench (one of my friends is a top-ranked factory certified Chevy mechanic) so he's getting me his price on parts and is willing to let me learn by assisting him with the motor and tranny work.

This will be my "summer at mechanic's camp" project so I'm pretty stoked to get started on it. I've put off learning my way around under the hood for 30 years. This car was promised to me when I was 10, so all those years I should have spent in auto shop, I was waiting to have "MY '58" to work on. I just didn't foresee that I would be 40 before that time came...

I located a web site called http://www.automotivetouchup.com/ that carries lacquer paints and primers in spray cans color matched to factory color codes. They also carry touch-up brush bottles, sprayer-ready pints, quarts and gallons (pre-mixed with automotive paint-grade solvents) and other supplies. I ordered enough to try it out on a few of the more unsightly spots. Hopefully this will give me a good spot cover until I'm ready to sink those thousands into the full strip to the metal and repaint job.

I just read up on the VCCA judging manual which offered some helpful guidance for paint touch-up. Apparently it's still considered original finish as long as less than 25% of the paint has been restored, so doing a little fix-up on the odd scratch or scrape here and there is the better way to go, especially since the paint is about 98% fine.

Hey Kennedy,

I see you're from Two-All-A-Tin....

Have you been to a Columbia River Region mtng?? First Tues of the month. I apologize if I'm not recalling seeing you.....

If you haven't, drop me a line and I'll get you directions, etc.

Cay Coral. Wow! What a period color!

You mentioned "valve covers." (As in plural.) So, 283 or 348?? Powerglide or Turboglide?? Tell us more....

Neat car.

Have fun!

Bill.

Hey Kennedy,

Me again. I see in your other thread about the air-ride suspension your 58 Bel Air has the 348, 250 horse engine.

Stand by folks. He'll be smoking up the tires anytime soon now!!!



Bill.

Not if he has the turboglide.

Thanks for the invite, Bill. I plan to do much more cruising to shows and events this summer once the motor's done and we're back on the road. Maybe even an overnighter to the coast or something. Mr. Goodwrench says she should drive to New York and back once we're done. I don't expect to smoke many tires in the process though.

I took a local community college class on auto restoration from Bill Becker last summer. The alumni of his classes are a sort of loosely-based club of all makes, models and automotive interests. We meet now and then for a show and shine, trade notes and see how projects are progressing from the last get-together. Here's the web page, if you or any other of these fine Northwesterners would like to check in:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/becker_auto_restoration/

Bill also schedules speakers for his classes if you have a restoration or Hot Rod related business or good information on restoration resources, like affiliation with VCCA.

Hi pkennedy58BelAir,

Your profile does not indicate you are a member of the VCCA. We have an extremely active region that meets at the Stamp Society on NE33rd St.

If you would like more information you may contact me privately or here on the site.

You may also click on the web site at the bottom of my posting for additional information.

We would like you to join us with your 1958 4Dr.

Thank you, I think I will fill out a form and take you up on this, Ray. I doubt I'll make the June meeting, but July's is a possibility.

Do you have details on the annual gathering for this August? The calendar is still showing the 2005 events.

Kennedy,

The "annual" NW August gathering this year is a "mini - meet" because of the every five year Nat'l Meet in CO.

Sketchy details are it's a travelling meet. Mostly over on the Coast. Newport to Astoria. Staying in a different place each night. Dates are something like Aug 17 - 19.

You should definitely try to attend our Columbia River Region mtng next Tues, June 6th. You'll be able to get more details and sign-up info there. Or you could go direct to Steve Kassis at The Filling Station for the info. His Willamette Valley Region is the 'host' region.

Bill.

I got my membership card yesterday and I'm carrying it today. First Tuesday of July is the 4th - I'll check the calendar for meeting reschedule, but we're a month or so out from being back in running trim.

Meanwhile, engine compartment detailing is coming along in starts and stops, I should have the exhaust manifolds back from ceramic coating any time now and heads back from the machinist in a couple of weeks, ready to apply Chevy Orange!

-Pat.

Good thinking Pat, however because of the Anniversary Meet, the meeting in July will be July 10th, a MONDAY.

When we get back from the Anniversary Meet the meeting will be back on schedule for the 1st Tuesday of the month.

Do you need directions to the meeting location?

I printed the location out of Map Quest, it should be easy enough to find if I can get there.

Good thing you mentioned the July meeting date. The web site's calendar has it down for July the 5th - of 2005. :eek: :rolleyes:

One mystery solved - the oil rings on all 8 cylinders were perfectly lined up instead of partly rotated or with gaps set at 180 degrees apart, so Mr. G tells me that's why we were getting the exhaust blow-by. (I SWEAR I didn't work on it myself before he tore it down, but not knowing any different before I was told how it should be, it sounds like something I'd do...)

Should be putting it together this week but it's looking bleak for making the Lake Oswego Heritage Council show next Sunday. Might make the September meeting, should definitely be back on the road for the October one... I'll get there, sooner or later.

While the ring gaps should be staggered having them in in line shouldn't cause blow=by as much as oil consumption ..I assume that you are replacing the rings.The upper ring is the compression (sealing) ring and may have lost tension.The lower two rings are the oil controll rings.

PK,

You should try to make the September (5th) mtng of the Columbia River Region. You'll get details on "Fun Days," which will be the following weekend down in Brooks at the Museum.

Bill.

I've gone about this job in what I think is the right way but with all the wrong timing. Started in spring when I should have been finishing up for show-n-shine season, now I'm finishing up in the fall just in time for rainy season storage. Live and learn.

Project is going really well though, engine is back in place, repainted in authentic colors with engine and engine bay detailed by yours truly. Used POR-15 on black rusted areas and have to go over those with low-gloss black to make it correct, but that can wait for another time I think.

Refresh job went very well, updated valves and seats for unleaded gas, a fresh set of cast iron rings, honed the cylinder walls and torqued everything to spec and proper tolerances. We also put in a high volume oil pump and are updating to a high-output coil and new wires and plugs, but keeping the authentic look. Engine runs and sounds strong, just have to finish up the tranny linkage and a few last details tonight and it should be on the road. And it's supposed to be a sunny weekend too, so there's hope for an autumn emergence and a little fun.

Got the touch-up paint right on the second try. The actual color is Arctic White, not Honey Beige. Should have known by the note on the color chart next to Arctic White (2-tones Only). Initial color match is very good; maybe not concours quality, but better than scarred bare metal that was there. I've got several pictures of before and after that I'll have to post to my personal web page.

Went to Brooks last year for the Oregon Steam-Up. It's a great place to go, and just a comfortable 30 minutes down the freeway from Tualatin. The Steam-Up is a two-weekend event showcasing all the old working steam-powered tractors, sawmill engines and the like. It has a summer country festival atmosphere without the seedy elememts of the modern carnival with midway and games of chance that county fairs have become. Columbia River Region should hold events there more often!

Hey,

Great 'report' PK.

So now the next Columbia River Region mtng is on Tues, October 3rd.

Come. And bring your 'new' car.



Bill.

My 60 El Camino has original red paint and as you know red is known to go flat soon. The method mr Mack suggested works well. I would recommend hand method and no machinery to do the process. Buffers would most likely destroy the surface from heat.

Went ahead with touching up spots with predictably mixed results. The Arctic White is a pretty close match and does very well to cover scratches that are through the white layer. It rubs down with cleaning compound to a very close match on the lower half of the car.

The Beige/Gold on the other hand was a disappointment. It's much brighter than the almost 50-year old upper half, and though some almost powdery metal flake is visible in the old paint, the size of the flakes in the new paint, though a very small flake itself, still looks much larger than the original. This makes a visual effect of bright gold when viewed from a high angle, near-matching beige-brown when viewed from a lower angle. Wet sanding with 2000 and rubbing with cleaning compound gets the blend a bit closer and better to my eye than rust showing through the paint, but it's not the best or a permanent paint fix by any means.