VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1933-1936 Starting the 36

I'm going to try and start the engine before I pull it from the frame mostly because I want to hear her run before I rebuild it.

I also read that I should spin the oil pump with an electric drill to try and move some oil around before I try and start her. Can someone explain where to do that? I'm not seeing a place to access the oil pump and spin it ??

I have a few questions though. I took some pix and asked questions on them. Also, I have a question regarding the electrical diagram. Thanks for your help.

My choice would be to remove the spark plugs and spin the engine over with the starter until you see the oil pressure gauge show pressure. This will get the oil moving with no load on the engine parts. Then install the plugs and get it running.

On the wiring diagram your arrow is pointing at the ammeter. They are showing the back of it. You are correct on the other pictures.

And turning the oil pump before starting, requires that you remove the distributor and then place a shaft (old screwdriver shaft, or homemade brass rod) down until it engages with the oil pump. Then turn it rapidly for a couple of minutes using an electric drill.

A lot of work since you need to reinstall the distributor afterwards and that gives you the opportunity to join the "Out by 180 degree" club!!!







PS. Excellent pictures, by the way.

Thanks all for the info. My wife tells me all the time I'm 180 degrees out already.

Think I'll just crank on her a bit with the starter and see if I can get her pressure up.

The 36, I'm talking about!

With the plugs removed it will turn over faster with less battery drain.

If you haven't heard it run yet why do you want to rebuild it?

"A lot of work since you need to reinstall the distributor afterwards and that gives you the opportunity to join the "Out by 180 degree" club!!!"

Ron,

This absolutely will not happen to you if you take one simple precaution before pulling the distributor:

Turn the engine until the timing ball and pointer align and the rotor is pointing to the #1 plug wire in the distributor cap.

Then after pulling the distributor to spin the oil pump you can put the distributor back in the exact position it was in before removal. You will never regret priming the oil system before firing an engine that has been in mothballs for a long time.

It may surprise you when you start it. Years ago I bought a 1952 Ford 8N tractor so I could blade my gravel driveway after each storm. I assumed it was a worn out junker although it ran but its oil pressure gauge didn't work. Just recently I put a new oil pressure gauge on it and to my amazement it has 35-40 psi even when thoroughly warmed up. It may be ugly from sitting out in the weather for over 60 years but according to the oil pressure gauge the engine is in pretty good shape inside.

I still have the oil pump priming tool I used on my '36 when I first fired it ip over 40 years ago. If you want to see it I'd be glad to send you a photo. You have my email address.

Its been sitting for many years in the dry texas heat. I'm guessing every gasket and seal needs to be replaced and I would rather start with a fresh engine and build up from there. I won't do unnecessary machine work but intend to open her up and measure and flush everything.

My 1936 comes from Bandera, Texas. Dad and me found it in a pasture in 1964. Dad said to pull the plugs, spray lubricating oil (wd-40) into the cylinders so the rings would have some lube. Might get by without replacing the rings. Sure enough the rings held. They are still in there right now. In 2012 I re-did the gaskets. I did have some leaks but nothing major. The oil and heat from the engine made the old gaskets seal. Watch the temp. on the old gal. These are bad about rust plugging up the brass water injector ports in the head. Good luck.

For those interested I got the 36 engine running today!!

She spurted and sputtered but SHE RAN!

Here's my question though:

When she started she made a rather load clunking sound for the first couple of minutes. The sound seemed to emanate from the area of the engine where it connects to the bell housing.
The clunk was hard enough to knock off some caked dirt in that area.

After a couple of minutes of running the clunking sound suddenly went away. I continued to run the engine for a few minutes and the sound never returned.

I had previously removed the oil pan and the pistons, connecting rods, crank and ect. all look in order.

The transmission is in neutral so I don't think that has anything to do with the sound.

The starter engages and disengages properly.

The sound doesn't seem apparent when I turned over the engine by hand or when I cranked the engine only when the engine is running.

Any Thoughts??

THX

A valve sticking - piston hitting the valve.

Any bent push rods?
An object on top of a piston that finally got diegested.

It may have been due to dry oil galleries that took a little while to fill and put reasonable oil pressure into the system and silence the noise.
Tony

I exercised the valves by pushing they down a little by hand before I started it.

Could be dry but the sound was like a hammer hitting the block not a scraping sound?? Enough to loosen dirt.

And the push rods don't look bent.

Here is a link to a video showing it starting. Notice at about 22 seconds in the sound goes away. In reviewing it, it sounds like piston slap to me?? But I could be really wrong. Kinda the same sound as a diesel engine running on after you turn off the key??

[IMG]http://i1319.photobucket.com/albums/t663/RonH4609/th_36%20running_zpsbf7grolx.mp4

Piston slap would not go away in 22 seconds....more like 5 minutes. A main bearing can thump for a few seconeds till the oil gets to it.
I would oil the valve stems with a light oil and pour some oil into the carb. throat with the engine running to lubricate the lower end of the stems. ATF or MMo is fine.

The "thumping" is normal for an engine having set a long time. The oil has drained completely from the main rear bearing. Other areas may be void of oil also. It does take some several minutes for the oil to reach all of the voids and provide lubrication for the first time. I would think that the next time you start you would not hear those sounds due to the oil having lubed all parts of the engine; however, if you do it is not normal. Then it is time to look for a problem.

Too much crankshaft end play can cause that sound. Putting in the clutch pushes the crank forward and then settles to center after it starts. if it does it next start try it once without pressing the clutch beforehand.

Change out that diaphragm in the fuel pump as soon as you can or you will start dumping gas into the crank case. The original type is made for the old gas. This "new" type regular will eat through it in a hurry. Improper gas flow to the carb will not help.

Ron,

If you decide to change the fuel pump diaphragm you can buy just the diaphragm from Ford parts suppliers. Chevy parts suppliers make buy a "kit" to get a diaphragm. I have a Ford diaphragm in my '36 Chevy fuel pump. It was $7.50 at Sacramento (California) Vintage Ford.

Thanks,
In this case my fuel pump was a gas can hung from a rafter directly feeding the carb intake using gravity. But I did see the fuel pump trying to work as I was cranking and running the engine.

I'll be sure to replace the diaphragm when I get to that.

Ron,

It's just good luck but there is a Delco fuel filter that fits perfectly inside the fuel pump glass bowl where the original screen fits. Debris that the screen would pass the filter catches.

You have my email address if you're interested in that conversion and/or other invisible mods that help reliability.