VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1912-1928 23 inch clincher rim

I have a 23' clincher rim that is wider than the rims I have for Model T Fords. It is 3-1/4 inches wide, overall. This is about 3/8 wider than the rims I have for 30 X 3-1/2 tires on a T.
The reason I suspect it might be Chevy is that the valve stem hole is offset in the opposite direction from the nearest lug just as it is on the 21" split demountable rims used on '25-'27 Fords and Chevys of near years. Also, one of the lugs is open for easier mounting. I have observed this more often on Chevy rims.
Forgot to mention, it is a Hayes rim with the lugs that have a wedge shape on the back side.
Any help in identifying this rim would be appreciated. I don't have any Chevys of this age so the rim is available if someone needs it.
Thanks.

Mike

I just measured a 1920 23" demountable rim, and it is just under 3" wide. I believe that this is a correct 1920 rim.
The 1924 parts book lists demountable rims by their tyre sizes such as 30" x 3 1/2" , but it does not equate to the actual rim size and width which is the 23" rim (to the inside of the tyre mounting surface)(or the inside diameter of the bare tyre).

No actual rim widths are listed.
Maybe it is a truck rim.?

Thanks Jack. The T rims always look very narrow to me. It is normal to notch the bead on the inside for the valve stem in order to squeeze the beads close enough for tire mounting. That would not be necessary on this rim.
I will post it for sale soon.

Mike

Hi Jack,
30 x 3.5" is just another way of stating the measurement. 30", less twice the tire, 7" in total) equals 23".

Clincher rim tires are measured to the groove where the rim fits, straight-sides to the base of the tire.

Regards
Al

If I am not mistaken 30x3 1/2 refers to outside diameter (30") and tread width (3 1/2").
The Hayes rim you have is indeed a Chev rim, early '25 and earlier. Do not forget that Chev used the same rim as Willys Overland from '24 and earlier. I have seen some of these rims with the valve hole offset to the opposite side of the open lug therefore Willys may have had this slight difference in their Hayes wheels and rims earlier on, but their later versions up to '24 were the same as Chev used into '25. To make one fit the other it is just a matter of drilling a valve hole to suit.
Willys switched to well-base split rim balloon tires by '24 onto the same 23" wheel. Chev did not change til late '25 but onto a 21" size.
Cheers,
Geoff.

Hi Geoff,
30" x 3.5" equals the overall height of the wheel and 3.5" equals the section of the tire. So, 300", less 3.5" and less another 3.5" equals 23".

A 21" wheel is actually the same height but being a flat base rim, it's measured by the diameter of the inside of the tire, + 4.50", plus another 4.5" bringing the total combination to 30"

The inside of a clincher tire is measured from the groove in the tire that the rim edge fits into.

Regards
Al

Thanks Al,
I stand corrected.
It can all get confusing; and of course there are a myriad of different dimensions one could also include connected to rim widths and profile heights for all the different sections. But 30 X 3 1/2 was easy wasn't it. They were 'at it' back then with tyre sizes and certainly busier today than ever with seemingly every new model having some crazy size tyre not previously thought of.
I have no idea why today we have sizes expressed in metric but rim size still in inches. And more recently some sizes have gone back to expressing outside diameter in inches.That seems to be the domain of the 4WD crowd.
Anyway I have ditched those horrible BE rims on my '25 Chev and gone over to the Willys rim now that the correct 4.40x 23 straight sided tyres are available for the first time since the 60's. Prior to this, very much oversize was all that was available.I also own a Willys Overland and as new identical rims are currently available from Brisbane; I bought two full sets as well as tyres.
The clincher rims are dogs. No wonder they were gone by the mid twenties.I have had my car for 45 years so reckon I have done time enough with them. Apart from being extremely hard to find without sharp rusted edges that cut the tyre bead through, at 50-60 psi they give a ride as hard as a dray full of bricks, induce a million rattles (no smooth hot-mix roadways within 200 miles of here), cause the car to slew violently over bumps or axle hop constantly.(shackles never seize!) Generally a miserable experience all round. And now we glide along in complete comfort without leaping all over the place and everything shaking and rattling in a frenzy; courtesy of the John North Willys somewhat advanced Overland.