VCCA Home Forums GENERAL DISCUSSION New User Forum 1928 capitol truck rear wheels will not turn.

This is a restored truck.
Took for a 15 mile drive, put in neutral and left to idle.
Shortly after, went to leave, put into gear (gears would shift) but no action on rear wheels.
When up on jacks, rear wheels do both rotate manually, so I believe the rear axles are ok. Manual says to look for: broken key drive pinion, rivets sheared in differential???
Not sure where these parts are located.
Just starting to dig deeper....suggestions? Thanks fro any help...Rob Heffernan London On Canada.

Rob,
Sorry to read about your problem. The trucks don't generally have a problem with broken axles. The problem is more likely in the propeller (drive) shaft where it goes into the pinion gear. Is there any noise when you turn one of the wheels? If you remove the top transmission cover and with transmission in neutral manually rotate the output shaft is there any noise or resistance to rotation? If a shaft is broken often the broken parts will be jagged and no longer evenly rotate. If the shaft has dropped down it may be rubbing on the housing or wobbling. Those can be clues to locate the problem.

If you can't find a noise or wobble then take off the differential cover and then have someone else rotate the wheels and transmission output shaft and look for movement or listen for noise. As an example if you turn a wheel and the axle is good then the axle gear will rotate. That process should let you find the problem.

Howdy Rob.......If it will go into gear without grinding with the engine running and the clutch depressed, then try without the clutch depressed. If then it still goes with little or no grinding then your problem is likely between the engine and the transmission(clutch). Usually if it's busted between the transmission and the dif then there is going to be some noise and it sounds like there isn't......

Rob
Welcome to Chatter.
With your problem, with engine stopped trans in gear raise 1 wheel off the ground you should not be able to turn the wheel that is off the ground. If you can lift the top off the gearbox and while a friend turns the wheel watch for gear movement, if no movement look at axle shafts or internal driveshaft or the 1 that surprised me the planetary gears in the differential centre.
Tony

THANKS FOR REPLY.
WITH REAR WHEELS UP ON SUPPORTS, I TURNED ONE AND THE OTHER DID TURN IN OPP DIRECTION, SO AXLES ARE OK.
TOOK OFF COVER TO UNIVERSAL AT TRAN AND IT TURNS WITH BACK WHEELS, SO SHAFT SHOULD BE OK.
THUR I HAVE HELP AND WILL LOOK FORWARD OF UNIV..WILL LET YOU KNOW ... THANKS ROB HEFFERNAN LONDON ON CAN

THANKS FOR REPLY.
WITH REAR WHEELS UP ON SUPPORTS, I TURNED ONE AND THE OTHER DID TURN IN OPP DIRECTION, SO AXLES ARE OK.
TOOK OFF COVER TO UNIVERSAL AT TRAN AND IT TURNS WITH BACK WHEELS, SO SHAFT SHOULD BE OK.
THUR I HAVE HELP AND WILL LOOK FORWARD OF UNIV..WILL LET YOU KNOW ...

I DID TRY PUTTING INTO GEAR WITH CLUTCH DEPRESSED AND NO GRINDING ALSO WITHOUT USING CLUTCH AND NO NOISE AT ALL. SO LOOKS TO BE CLUTCH..WILL FIND OUT THURS ... THANKS ROB HEFFERNAN LONDON ON CAN

THANKS FOR REPLY.
WITH REAR WHEELS UP ON SUPPORTS, I TURNED ONE AND THE OTHER DID TURN IN OPP DIRECTION, SO AXLES ARE OK.
TOOK OFF COVER TO UNIVERSAL AT TRAN AND IT TURNS WITH BACK WHEELS, SO SHAFT SHOULD BE OK.
THUR I HAVE HELP AND WILL LOOK FORWARD OF UNIV..WILL LET YOU KNOW ...

I DID TRY PUTTING INTO GEAR WITH CLUTCH DEPRESSED AND NO GRINDING ALSO WITHOUT USING CLUTCH AND NO NOISE AT ALL. SO LOOKS TO BE CLUTCH..WILL FIND OUT THURS ... THANKS ROB HEFFERNAN LONDON ON CAN

I ALSO TRIED THIS:
I DID TRY PUTTING INTO GEAR WITH CLUTCH DEPRESSED AND NO GRINDING ALSO WITHOUT USING CLUTCH AND NO NOISE AT ALL. SO LOOKS TO BE CLUTCH..WILL FIND OUT THURS ... THANKS ROB HEFFERNAN LONDON ON CAN

Hi Rob,

Another test would be to completely loosen the clutch adjustment so that, theoretically, the clutch is engaged and cannot be disengaged. Then, with the truck on the ground, put the tranny in gear (engine off) and try to roll the vehicle.

If the truck tries to turn the engine, then your clutch just needs to be adjusted. If the truck rolls without turning the engine, then it sounds like you need to pull the tranny and see what's going on.

BTW, you can pull the tranny without pulling the engine. Jack the truck up and support the chassis so the rear end hangs down. This will give you enough room to disconnect the u-joint and drop the torque tube down.

Be safe, no matter what you do. Use lifts and friends with these operations. The tranny is heavy! Don't get hurt.

P.S. Turn off your caps lock key when you type. Besides being harder to read, all capital letters imply that you are shouting, which is obviously not the case.

Cheers, Dean

Howdy Rob...It seems that you've either #1 lost your throwout bearing( you would have felt that on your pedal) #2 lost the fibre on your clutch disc or it wore out in a hurry( you would have likely heard that) or #3 your pressure plate has lost it's tension or pressure and then isn't hooking up the transmission to the engine....
Regardless of what is happening to it have fun eh...Terry

The center of the clutch place may have broken away. Normally when that happens there is a noise as the parts move past each other. Typically the problem is that the clutch will not disengage instead of does not engage.

HI Dean...
Caps off so here we go...The problem does appear to be with the clutch/throwout bearing.
Thanks for the idea of supporting chassis and hanging the rear end down.
The universal is very close to coming apart now and that should make the difference to get the torque tube clear for tranny removal.
Tranny looks good.
Clutch adjustment was completely loosened and clutch still cannot be disengaged, so off with tranny to dig deeper.
Will keep you posted and thanks again for the idea.
Rob Heffernan London On, Canada

Thanks to all for ideas re rear wheels not turning.
The original 86 yr old clutch center spline was broken away.
I was able to find a new improved clutch + better throwout bearing set up from a very helpful Gary Wallace in St Louis MO.
thanks again ..Rob Heffernan London On Can

Thanks for your help. Your suggestion turned out to the be correct one. Only thing odd was that there was no noise coming from clutch area. The entire center spline of the clutch broke away. Clutch had been resurfaced but original plate. Lasted 87 years.

All is back together but now the starter will not turn over even with applying + booster cable directly to it.
Flat spot?

Thx for your help. Rob Heffernan in London Ontario canada

This maybe a silly suggestion buit does the engine turn over when you turn the harmonic balancer (belt pulley on the front of the engine. If not the starter wont turn it either.
Tony

When in high gear can you rock the truck and have the engine rotate? Or use a large screwdriver to pry the teeth on the flywheel ring gear. Be careful as you can bend the crankshaft with too much force. If the engine does not turn relatively easily with one of those or similar method the starter probably will not turn it over either.