VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 Wiring Harness for Town and Country Horns

I've purchased a NOS wiring harness for a 39 but I don't think it comes with wiring for the Town and Country Horns. Suppliers look like they want $80.00 and up. What are the specs and where do you get the stuff to make one? It seems as though it shouldn't be that hard? Thanks, regmudd

You can get the items needed to make a harness for your horns from either YnZ or Rhode Island Wiring.

Good timing as I have a set of town & country horns coming my way. Is it safe to assume you cannot use your existing horn wiring to control the town & country horns? My 38 has two firewall mounted horns, one on the left and one on the right.
Thanks
Mike A

The 1939 T&C horns require a switch that is mounted on the dash. The switch allows you to choose between the original "town" horn and the accessory "country" horns."
Let me know if that is what you have and I can email you the instalation nsructions.
The 1939 is the only year this exact feature was used.

I actually did see a town & country switch. Below is the catalog for the 1938 Chevrolet and a matched set of horns was an option, but they do not refer to them as Town & Country.

I have two horns and I think they might be slightly different sizes. I didn't think they put two horns in as a standard item and presumed they were the town and country. Regmudd

My horns are not on the firewall but sit on a wire frame over the engine.

The 1939 T&C horns came with a dash switch that had a plate that said "City/Country". Chevrolet described the accessory horns a "Double-Duo" and they were painted gray and mounted on the dash to radiator rods. They cost $9.50 in 1939.

The accessory horns on my '38 are mounted via a bracket that mounts to the "V" brace & a support between the bracket & firewall. A pre restoration pic is below.

Mine looks like your setup. regmudd@msn.com

Let me look at my car for the switch if there is one. Thanks. Regmudd

On my car the single horn was disconnected and the accessory horns were connected to the horn button. I made my own "Town & Country" horn switch using a three position (on circuit one/off/on circuit 2), two pole toggle switch. In the circuit one on position the single horn works & the accessory horns work in the circuit two on position. The OFF position is handy when I'm working around the horn button to prevent accidental honking. I hid the toggle switch under the dash. You can see it here next to my voltmeter.

Makes sense and thanks.

Chev Nut

I just bought these horns. Wondering if you could share a diaghram tohook them up on my 37 Chevy? I have modern 12 wire universal wiring. There is a wire marked "horn"

Thanks,

John K.

[img:left]https://get.google.com/albumarchive...thKey=CKX21smxoYnzXA#6398677135904875762[/img]

This might help,



Brian

John, T&C horns were an accessory in 1939. With this accessory you installed the dual horns plus a dash mounted switch that enabled you to select using the original horn or the dual horns.
Prior to 1939 if you installed the accessory dual horns the original horn was disconected and removed.
Which use ae you planing to use?

Gene

I have a 36 FA (36-1011) that I plan to install the dual horns as well. I was of the opinion that this an option back in the day. Based on your post this switch was not an option right? Is the wiring harness need to be modified in some way to accommodate this dual horn option?

Thanks,
Tom H.

The under hood dual horns were an accessory for 1935 Master and all 1936 cars. The dual horns have a horn relay mounted to the horn mounting bar. The tabs the the wires attach to on the horns sould have ID letters on them. Because two horns draw a lot of amps a wire (12 Ga.) is run from the starter switch directly to the relay Another wire (16 Ga) goes to a relay terminal (it is a ground) and the third terminal on the relay connects to the horns themselves.
I can't find my instuctions as to which terminal is which so some one can help with that. I believe the S terminal is for the hot wire, H to the horns and G to the connector that runs up the steering column.

Thanks

The original horn is gone. So I guess only the T & C horn. I had some black under the hood horns, but when I sold my 38, I sold the horns separately. Now that I have the 37, I wish that I would not have sold them.

These are the markings on the EA horns that I have. Thanks for all the help guys!

Seeing they are not GM horns that may be hard to do. Do you have a good picure of the relay terminals?

Found this when i was looking for a description how to wire the Town and Country Horn. Now im surprised, because on my 1940 there are other Horns installed and i have two Horn Relais. Accessories Catalog from 1940 shows T&C as a Option.
My Wiring Harness needs to be restored, but the wiring does not make sense for me - but it worked. Why only one wire to the T&C Switch? Cutting the ground? Please look at my wiring plan and tell me how does it work? Did i make a mistake?

The 1940 and 1941 cars came with two matched horns.
The town and country accessory cut out one horn for the city position of the switch.
The 1939 town and country horns were a pair of matched horns and the original horn was maintained for the city horn.
There was a dual horn accessory for 1938 and prior and when they were installed the original horn was removed as there was no T&C switch offered.

In 1940 the US cars had the horns mounted at about the same level as the head lights.

And what do you think about the wiring? Why only one Cable to the switch?

This point must have been overlooked in this entire thread. All wiring between the radiator and grill is routed through the round support rod that runs across the front of the radiator. In most cases the horn wires exit on each end of the support rod and go directly to each horn.

If you are going to purchase any bulk wire or a harness, Y&Z are my recommendation.

To buy a wiring is no option for me, because mine is a right hand drive - talked about this with YZN.
And one Fuse is not very save, so will try do make a complete new, optimized wiring.
Again the question. Is my drawed wiring possible. Why the connection in the middle between second Horn Relais, Light Switch and first Horn Relais?

Link to a bigger Image

That connection in the middle is providing Positive (+6 volts) directly to the horn relay so the horns do not draw power through the Ammeter or Ignition Switch. This prevents damage due to the large current draw by not going through the Ignition or Ammeter.
Just like a modern car, you want the horn to work without the car running as well.
I think this diagram is lacking some connections to the Town an Country Switch as a switch requires at least 2 connections and I suspect would need to be tied to horn ring. Find other wiring diagrams (even close model years) and compare them all so you eliminate any possible printing errors from the day or in being copied.

Andre,

I think the switch grounds to the dash when a selection is made.

Just be clear, Gene, I think you say, and have implied, that there were no trumpet style horns for the 41 and later models. Accordingly, the switch for 41 merely controlled one or the other of the existing horns. Low tone for city and both for country. Is this correct?

Thanks,

Charlie

Thats correct Charlie, look here
http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/accessories/40ca/40ca07.html

Ground to the dash, that was my opinion too

I agree with Tim. The one link missing to me is a wire that connects the Town & Country switch back to the horn button. That wire is needed so the second relay is activated when the horn button is pushed (grounded) and the switch is in the Country position.

Grounding to the dash will make the second horn blow continuously when the switch is in the Country position.

As you can see, only one cable at the Switch..

I would still suggest finding some other diagrams to compare. I think something is missing in the diagram if the T&C switch only connects to one wire/ground as the upper horn is isolated from the horn button.

If you look at the wire coming from the steering column in the diagram, there is something unusual in the schematic. Right above the ammeter there is a thick arch drawn with 3 lines on it. If you go over to the horn nearest the T&C switch, there is a similar thick arch with 3 lines that is not crossing any other wires. It seems to me they were trying to show a crudely drawn connection/selector switch between these two points.

Thanks for the picture of the switch. I agree that it strongly indicates that the switch does ground internally. It would be easy to check that with an ohmmeter.

Given that it does ground internally, I still agree with Tim that there is something missing in the wiring diagram. I cannot understand how the second relay is connected to the horn button.

Will check this on Saturday

@ canadiantim. Unfortunately there are no electrical diagrams with the town and country horn and two relays. The three lines you mean are from the original schematic, I just erased them to have a better overview.

I will show the complete schematic later. Of course it cannot be excluded that I made a mistake when removing and documenting the old wiring harness.

I wonder if Gene has a copy of the original instructions? Can't think of where else we could find a source for the wiring diagram for these.

I just realized I have a set of these to wire up eventually so glad you've posted about this as I'll have to figure out the wiring eventually anyway. You could PM or email me the diagrams if it's too ugly to post.

The schematic in the above link is the easiest way to connect these. Both horns are connected in parallel and only one relay is used. Both horns operate 100% of the time when the horn button is used.

If you want the T&C switch to work: You could simply add a 2nd relay at the 2nd horn that is controlled by the T&C switch.

I'm attaching two pictures. One showing the original wiring schematic and one showing how to add the T&C switch. You could do the same wiring with a small horn on the manifold and then TWO horns added in parallel to the 2nd relay operated by the T&C switch.

EDIT: There is a problem with the detail for the relay wiring but this is a general sketch of how it could be wired. No time to edit right now. How many terminals do your relays have?

Thanks for the schematic. I have three Terminals. 9 to horn and 20(10) to Lightswitch is shure, what i know about the Connections. Only at 30(11) could happen a mistake in my plan for the second horn

Yes Sir! So, no Mistake om 30(11). Tested this with the Multimeter.

Ohoh, but other mistakes in my Plan. What have i drunk that Evening . Now, here is the correct plan for T&C Wiring on 1940. Looks like your drawing canadiantim. My problem was, that I had labeled some cables inside with the same number i used outside, when I disassembled them.

Ray,

Thanks for the information. I'm sure a heap of guys are interested in getting it right.

As for me and the 41, I don't like the switch sitting up there on the dash. It looks just terrible up there. It looks like a dried out chunk of snot or a dead beetle of some kind right out of the deepest part of a jungle somewhere. Does too! On first sight you want to take your hand and flip the thing out the window.

Worst accessory switch ever from Chevrolet. (How's that for not ending a sentence with a preposition?)

Best

Charlie

Hi Andre,

I agree that your wiring should work. I doubt if we will ever know the "real" solution, but yours will work.

Pushing the horn button will create a ground path and activate the first relay. Power will go from the first relay to that one horn and to the second relay. The second relay will activate only if the T&C switch is set to "Country" which will ground that relay.

Another question. How does an 3 Pin Relay works inside? Only know 4 Pin Relays.

In a 3 pin relay there is only one connection that feeds power to both the coil in the relay and the downstream function that it turns on. That is why the one wire that brings power to the relay has to be large enough to carry the amperage for the downstream function such as the horn or lights.

In a 4 pin relay there are actually 2 wires that bring power to the relay. One small wire provides power for the coil in the relay. A larger wire provides power to the contact points within the relay. The coil circuit and the "power" circuit are not connected electrically.

The downstream pins are the same on both relays One completes the circuit to energize the coil and the other sends power to the function.

This also explains why the horn relay on our Chevy's is part of a "grounding" circuit. The wire going to the horn button can be small because the only electrical load on it is the energy to close the coil. That happens when you complete the coil circuit by pushing or "grounding" the horn button.

ok, understand. Like this.

Exactly! Pictures are better than words!

Hope you got the horns to finally make some noise. Sorry I vanished from the thread after getting involved. I ended up with a rash of funerals all a plane ride away so have been preoccupied and funding the airline's projects rather than my own...