VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 Vibration

Hello All,

Even though I haven't posted in awhile, I still visit on a regular basis, so sorry for coming right in with a question.

I know it's hard to diagnose issues without seeing the vehicle, but here goes.

I recently decided to replace my driveline bushing with an Oakie Bushing from the Filling Station.

Even though the oil wasn't running back and overfilling the rear-end, I didn't want it to later on.

My car (41 Special Deluxe)had a vibration when driving at highway speeds, so I thought while the driveline was apart, may as well go ahead and replace the u-joint which I am glad I did, because the original one was worn out and had a lot of play in it.

I decided to have a reputable local shop do the work because I just simply hate working under a car now that I am getting older.

Before the work began, I had a good long visit with the tech, explaining enclosed drive lines, and supplied him with the portion from my service manual covering that area of the car, along with the technical information on set up and proper adjustment on the u-joint ball.

Anyhow, the tech did a good job and the vibration the car had before was gone. Only thing is, there was now an oil leak at the u-joint ball/slip joint area, so I went by there and told them what was going on and they said they would make it right because their work is under warranty.

I got another new set of gaskets and took the car to them today for the tech to fix the leak.

He got the drive tube apart and put in the gaskets and there was no leak, but said when he test drove the car it now has a vibration and agreed that it did not this morning when I brought the car in, and he drove it before tearing the driveline apart.

For the life of me, I can't figure out what could be vibrating since 1. The new u-joint took care of the original vibration, and 2. A new Oakie Bushing was installed.

My car has a 235 from a 1961 Chevy pick up with the cars original tranny and when the tech put the new bushing in a few weeks ago, he said he had to take the rear end lose and move it back in order to have enough room to drop the drive line because he didn't have room.

I have never had to drop the drive tube down on a Chevy car but have on old 3100 Chevy pick ups and never had that issue.

I don't know if the 235 engine is a different length than 216 was, causing a difference in room or not.

Anyway, I can't figure out what could be vibrating now.

Anyone had this problem before?

Thanks all for any replies!!

Kevin

One thing could be that the ball housing is not adjusted right. It cant be to tight or it will cause this problem. The manual tells how to adjust it,stiff but can be moved by hand with some pressure. There are shims in the kit for this.

Hey chevy1937!

I suppose that could be the issue, although not sure. I went by the shop at lunch and the tech had the ball assembly on the back of the tranny like the tech article states, and he showed me it was tight, but he could still move it.

Wonder if he got it mis-adjusted when he put it all back together? I didn't think about that.

Kevin

Hi Kevin,

I don't know if the following chat link is helpful or not but you and your mechanic should be aware of the information in it. Hopefully, the bolts are not torqued more than 12 pounds that hold the ball slip-joint in place. Oil leaks are not uncommon in this location. Most of us would probably put a little drip (under four drops) on ignore!!!

Good luck, Mike

1929-54 torque tube gassket kits

Loosen the four ball collar bolts about 1/4 turn and test it on the road for the vibration.

Hey there Mike & Gene!

Gene, the more I have been studying on this issue, I think you all (including chevy1937), are right about the u joint ball adjustment because I know if it's too tight it will make noise.

Mike,

Thank you for sharing that link. I remember reading it awhile back. I know that before I had the work done, it didn't leak near as bad as did now so that's why I took it back to the shop.

Lance (the tech), said he had the leak stopped, but then had the vibration when he test drove the car.

I am going to tell him Monday to try to run them 1/4 loser as Gene recommended. I took Lance the technical article from the Filling Station and he read it but not sure if he torqued the bolts as it said or not.

I appreciate all the advice.

Kevin

It is difficult (impossible?) to find a mechanic (tech) who knows about these ol' cars. But, know in advance you are in big trouble when you have to attempt tell a mechanic how to repair on of 'em.

'Bet the guy overtightened in an attempt to prevent the leaking.

Good luck!

Morning Gaither!

Yeah, I am believing that is exactly what has happened because there is nothing else that can be vibrating.

I am planning to go to the shop first thing Monday morning and discuss this with him.

Kevin

Getting the proper tightness of the ball housing is a bit tricky. Too loose = leaks, too tight = vibration as the ball does not easily properly align.

Yep....getting the correct adjustment on the ball is critical. I agree that could be the cause of your vibration.

Good information by all. Just curious about getting a vibration if the ball socket is to tight? Thanks Don

So here's another question that has kinda been a stumper. On the retaining ring at the end of the u-joint ball, you have the 2 flat washers and gasket.

That is the area where most of the oil was leaking from when I took the car back into the shop.

I am wondering what is proper placement for the 2 washers and this is the reason I want to make sure.

If you place one washer in the ring first, then the cork gasket, then a washer, it would make sense that you have an area between the end of the ball housing and washer where oil can leak.

If you place the 2 washers in the ring first, to act as shims then place the cork gasket in last, the gasket will compress against the end of the ball housing, sealing it so oil don't leak.

What is correct?

Thanks!!

Kevin

Replace the cork gasket with an O-ring. Put the O-ring between the two washer retainers so it does not move forward or back. If the O-ring is compressed when the ball housing is installed then it will provide leak protection. The rubber O-ring is much better than cork.

Thanks Chipper,

Unfortunately the Fel Pro gasket set did not come with an ordinary rubber o-ring like were used to, and it may not necessarily be cork either.

When we looked at the washer/o-ring/washer set up it just looked like oil could pass through between the end of the ball housing and the first washer so that's why it was installed the way it was.

We can easily change it though as the drive tube is still open, and down.

Thanks!!

Kevin.

The gasket goes between the two washers.

The "O" ring is a common size and it can be purchased locally.

I don't mean to be dense but I don't have a clear visual of what you are referring to as two flat washers? I have had atleast 4 rear ends with complete torque tubes, all were for 41 Chevy passenger cars, and none of them had any washers on them. They only had the cork gaskets and shims. I assumed mine leaks a little because I might not be tightening the rear (back) retaining collar enough? Can anyone show me what the washers look like? Perhaps we are confusing different model years and only the 1933-36 used washers with an O-ring???

I don't like to tighten my retaining collar very much because it takes a pipe wrench to untighten it and this chews up the collar.

Have a good day, Mike

Good morning Mike,

I called them flat washers but I am sure they are shims. And your thinking right as far as what I was referring to.

The shims that go on each side of the o-ring or cork o-ring in the retaining ring.

It just wasn't making sense to me as to how a good seal could be achieved because of the metal to metal, (one shim, then cork gasket or o-ring).

I kept thinking oil can slip out between the end of the u-joint ball, and the first shim.

Kevin

Actually the two metal pieces are more accurately described as retainers. The serve to retain the seal or O-ring and keep it from extruding out the back or moving forward. There is plenty of force exerted on the seal when the rear end moves up and down and the therefore the torque tube has to move forward and back inside the ball (or U-joint) housing.

Mike,
I would suggest a strap wrench to tighten the collar. The one that has the plastic handle and rubber strap. There is also one with metal handle and fabric strap that could be used. The metal handle and chain is a third choice. Or you can wrap the collar with thin rubber and then use the pipe wrench. There are even more "ways to skin that cat" and not leave evidence.

Remember there was a felt packing ruberized on the sides between the two "washers" The washers compressed the felt making it an effictive seal. Modern kits come with a hard cork/rubber like material and the material takes a lot to compress.
The above is for the slip joint on the back of the ball.
The ball seal originally was a graphite coated cork.

Well,

The tech got the car lined out today. No vibration, drives nice. Just a slight oil leak at the retainer collar but I can live with it.

Thanks everyone for all your replies and input.

Kevin

So...what did the Tech. do to get rid of the vibration?

Yeah, JYD. I've been following this thread and I would like to know what the solution was, also.

Charlie

car lined out !

Good evening all,

Here's what happened. When he mocked up the u-joint ball housing to check the adjustment, he had the ball joint collar seal installed.

No wonder he got a false adjustment, and vibration. Once I talked it over with him again, he said he understood. Even told me he learned a few things.

So, car is lined out now. New u-joint, oakie busing and smooth driving!!!

Kevin