VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 1940 starter switch

Hello everybody here!
Had my "blue whale" 1940 4door special deluxe garaged for the winter but something happened. The house and the garage were sold now and the new owner came and said "leave as fast as possible, its all mine now and next week they begin to rebuild all and house and garage will be demolished and pulled down.
So I had come for rescue and had to wake up my car and to slide in heavy snow, salt and ice to a new place.
Was not a nice ride, but I got it.
Now my question:
Again, (ok, last time about 2 years ago) the starter switch was not working, means I had to press the starter pedal several times to get a contact and to get the starter running.

That happened same about 2 years ago and never again, but to be on the safe side I ordered a starter switch at FS but did never put it in because it never happened again until some days ago.
Now I was downstairs in my storage to find the new FS-starter switch I bought in 2010 and I am not sure about the quality. it looks a bit poor. Does anybody have any experience with that kind of aftermarket-switch? I dont want to work some hours to change the switch and after that it works not better than before because of the quality of the switch...

Stefangermany

I rebuilt and cleaned up my starter on my `40 last summer , and it was easy. I would think just cleaning the contact area should fix you up ....and if not , put on the new part ...I don`t think you should worry about the quality of the part.....maybe can use some of the new part with the old switch? anyway ...good luck and get the salt off the old girl!.....Martinomon

It is far more common for the problem with the starter not "starting" due to the connection from the battery to cables and cable to starter switch. That is not to say that the starter switch can not be bad. Cleaning the contacts on the switch is a gamble but a thorough inspection of their condition should determine if replacement is advised.

Thanks for reply! No it is not a problem of cables and terminal. The cables are all new and the terminal is clean, the problem is indeed the starter switch. Tried to get it out today, but no success. The outer screw was easy, but the inner one I could not open. There is not enough space between starter and engine block to get a screw driver into the right position.
Seems I have to get out the whole starter unit to get access to that inner screw. Presently I cannot do anything. The worse is, as written I lost my garage and workplace just now. The car is now stored in the usually wet underground garage of the block where I have my apartment and there everything except parking a car is forbidden. Bad situation...

It seems that storage is a worldwide problem with old cars. I have usually found that its necessary to remove the starter to work on it on our '40.

have u tried a short wide - heavy bladed screwdriver & a vise grip on the screwdriver shaft ? for leverage .
also i had to " ream out " the mounting screw holes out , to get the start switch a little closer to the stud contact area on the starter . ( if this is like a 1939 chev footstarter )
good luck , the 39

What you need is called a Stubby screwdriver.

The easy way remove starter it will make it easy to a line the switch contacts.
Al

Thanks for all input.
But now another question is growing up. I did study the new aftermarket spare parts switch I bought long time ago. If the switch button is pressed it does just connect the cable terminal with the switch housing.
Sorry, I dont understand the electrical circuit.
If the cable terminal is (+) from battery and I press the starter button the battery (+) is connected to the outer starter housing.
Thinking about that I guess the follow up must be a massive short circuit because the starter is mounted into the "flywheel bell" (is it the right word?) and that is grounded by beeing mounted on the grounded engine block. All that does not match together in my mind, but maybe there is a big misunderstanding of the electrical circuit of the starter. Is anybody able to help me to understand it? I did study all theoretic sources I have (repair manuals, service news, books and so on) and could not find one single word about that miracle.
Thanks in advance
Stefangermany

the starter button is insulated from the ground ( - ). when pressed to the starter it completes a + to + circuit , engauging
the starter . ( like plugging in an electric cord ). frank

The starter housing has a insulated contact that is connected to the field winding, that is why I said it would be easier to aline the switch with the starter removed.
Al

ok, thanks, seems the aftermarket spare part switch I bought 2 years ago at FS in Oregon is a wrong one. Because it has indeed a insulated cable terminal but nothing else. The cable terminal is to be connected to battery (+) and in case of pressing the button that does a connection to the starter switch housing and not to any other cable terminal because there is no. I guess thats a wrong one switch...

Stefangermany

Sounds like you have the wrong starter. Your starter should have a connection on top that is connected to the switch that is connected to the battery. You depress the starter switch and the connection is made to the connection on the starter.

Stefan
It will be easier to get the starter off the car and the switch apart. That way you will see that 1 of the connectors is fixed to but insulated from the main housing (connected to the field coils) while the other connector is fixed to and insulated from the switch cover (connected to the battery).
Tony

Hi Stefan, The first picture shows a 41 starter. I think your 40 starter should look like this one minus the reversing switch on the right top of the starter. The next two pictures show a new starter switch. Usually these switches fail from wear on the two copper parts shown in the third picture. I assume that is where your problem is. When the two copper surfaces come in contact electricity is passed from the battery to the copper hump on the starter motor. The 4th picture shows the contact area. Over the years a pattern wears in the copper on the switch and gradually the contact becomes harder to make. You will know the condition of your switch when you take it off. Good luck, Mike

P.S. Stefan it's time for you to move to Michigan we have lots of garages!!!

Hello Mike, thanks a lot, I guess you did open my eyes and now I know how it should be. As posted I could not remove the starter switch to see what is under it. But your pictures show clearely how it should work. Ok, now I know about what and why, but presently I cannot work on my car, because I lost my garage and workplace and now I just have a place in a underground garage where it is only allowed to store a car. and the housekeeper unfortunately is like a hawk and is checking and controlling everything all the time, so there is no chance to work on my car...hope to find a new workplace in spring otherwise I have to go to "professional" garages and mechanics working under pressure of time without any knowledge about vintage cars and pay much money for bad work or sell the car...
Stefan

The original Delco-Remy part number for the starter switch is:

820052

A very common starter switch from the late '20's up to the mid to late '40's.