VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1912-1928 The Filling Station - Motometer Fault

Gidday Fellas,

Just pointing out something to any future buyers of new motometers from the Filling Station that should of been made clear to me and that is:

The reproduction motometer is only suited to left hand drive cars, yes left hand drive cars only, sounds a little funny you would think but true. (see photos below)

After receiving, installing and testing my motometer I noticed that I cannot see the temp reading from the right hand side driving positioning of my Aussie 1928 Chev, if I want to get a reading while driving I have to lean right across to the passenger side and take a quick peak, just a little dangerous! I actually thought the red sealed temp dial had twisted and that the gauge was faulty so I sent an email and then I rang the Filling Station to discuss the part.
I asked if it could be replaced and also to test the new motometer prior to sending it over to Australia as the cost of the gauge and the $20.00 postage was about $70.00

I then forwarded the below photos also as requested explaining the faulty part.

After viewing my photos I received a lovely email stating that:

"Our vendor has designed them to be easily visible to a person sitting in the driver seat on a left hand driver vehicle. Right hand drive vehicles were an afterthought to them since they are an American manufacturing company. Unfortunately, they have no plans to produce a Motometer that is readable from the right side or dead on center

Best regards.
The Filling Station

Any refund?? Any credit?? Nope, not a bloody thing.

This is a straight on pic and please note that the motor is running at normal temps in these photos



From the drivers seat



From the passengers side and the red temp gauge is readable




I think some extra working in their catalogue and online shopping is needed to warning people and it's not the first time that I have brought parts from them, actually I have brought a good many parts from them over the last two years and if my wife actually knew how much I'd spent I'd be out in the dog house for a good while I would expect...

A left hand drive Motometer, really fellas!

I suppose I could turn the gauge around to 2 & 4 o'clock but gee, would't that look great, then again everything else on my ole chevy is crooked and or out of line.

Hey Monty the Chev,
At the risk of having you give me one of your sermons, STOP your continual whinging and stay off the chat site. You give the rest of us Australian Chevrolet owners a bad name. Sick and tired of your carry on. The Motor meters have been used by others with no problems and we have been greatful that someone made a reproduction so that we can keep an eye on the engine temp. No doubt you will not accept this reply and have some smart remark, further reinforcing why you should stay off this site. I would tell you this to your face so don't think I am one of the so called face less few my name is Dave Perry and I for one am sick of you on this site. We have put up with your behaviour for far to long.
TWIN4

Gidday Fellas,

Dave, Sorry but this was a genuine issue I was pointing out, I have never used a motometer before and thought it very strange that I would have to lean right across to read the gauge, Mike from the filling station was good on the phone when I spoke to him and was also unaware of the "left hand side" made faces until it was pointed out to me in his return email..
Natural then as one would, after paying good money I thought a refund or credit note would be offered considering I have spent a good few dollars with their business restoring my chevy and I genuinely thought the gauge a little dangerous to use like that and it not mentioned when I brought it considering they know it is a right hand drive car and that I am from Australia, but now you have pointed it out to me that all motometer gauges are like that then I will live with it and keep leaning across to the passenger side to view.

Yes Dave, my nature is blunt and very straight forward but a whinger no, far from it.
My down fall is I do ask the question and push the boundaries, have done all my life and will mostly likely continue to do so, that's just me and I am sorry to offend in anyway..

I`ve often wondered why I have to lean towards the passenger side to read the motometer, hadnt thought of the left / right hand drive thing.

I suspect the medium in the bulb would be an alcohol with red dye. For this to be effective it would require a thin capilery tube with a limited viewing angle.

The answer would be to find an old gauge with mercury in it, This may have a larger viewing angle and the added bonus of providing a leathal injection of heavy metal to any young punk who tries to snap off your hood ornament.

I have a box filled with parts from both my ford and chev that I have bought from the U.S. that dont fit, each time I learn somthing new like their windscreen wipers go the other way (that one cost me a bundle), but without the U.S. reproduction industy I would not be able to complete my projcts as easily, so a few things I cant use is a small price to pay.

Your posting title reads Motometer Fault, I would not consider it to be a fault but more a slight inconvenience we must endure for living in this great country of ours.

Grant, thanks for posting this problem. Although I live in the US, I find small details like this fascinating.

I googled 'repair motometer' and a lot of hits came up. One in particular (pardon the instances of F**d on this page), shows various parts for rebuilding a motometer. I wonder if you can rotate the thermometer within your motometer to be visible from the correct drivers side in your part of the world?

Here's the link: http://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/modelaparts/motormeter-1

Here's another promising place: http://www.restorationstuff.com/

Check out the motometer parts in their catalog.

Let us know if you find a solution.

Cheers, Dean

Gidday Fellas

Thanks for the replies, and interesting to note that both of you were also unaware of the minor issue with the motometer face..

Dean I will try over the weekend to repair the temp tube inside, see what I can do and I will let you know.

When driving my ole banger I like to constantly check the temp a lot and glance at the gauge a good few times a minute, hence the reason why I "asked the question" with the filling station to begin with and funnily enough they were unaware of it also..

Live and Learn..

Well, I've got to step in for a minute here.

1. Knock off the name-calling. I don't care who starts it, or how it progresses. If you find fault with a posting - just SKIP IT. Go a different one. Stop making the discussions "personal".

2. The topic of this thread was VERY INTERESTING.
I suspect that a lot of folks get "messed up" when buying parts only to find out that they are "right handed", not "left handed" (or reversed). That is life. Don't complain about it - just do your Homework.

3. It appears that The Filling Station was kind of caught off guard too by this left vs. right issue on the Motometer. I'd be REALLY surprised if they didn't offer you a refund. You didn't say specifically that you requested one.

If you are really UN-satisfified AND The Filling Station won't refund, then SEND THE MOTOR METER TO ME and I'll pay you the book price plus $20 for shipping. It will make a nice display-shelf item for me and then you won't have to strain yourself trying to read your temperature. (Begin this with a PM to me.)

... and that will kill this discussion.

I'm on the verge of taking action the next time that someone (whether US or Aus) makes a negative comment about a PERSON. Everyone, please take note.

DO NOT RESPOND TO THE POSTING ABOVE TO DISCUSS PEOPLE ISSUES OR HOW I RUN THE BOARD.

This thread is for auto-related comments.

I am amazed. I have been driving my 28 for about 20 years and never noticed a problem with that little red line. I imagine that my repro Motometer was made for the US market and was not modified to suit me.I must admit that if the Motometer turned a little to the left then I couldn't read it but that was all. There is always the possibility that I was unwittingly moving my head a little to read it.Now I have something extra to check on next time I go out.

Maybe yours is old enough (20 years?) that it still employed mercury, instead of the thinner (much harder to see) capillary tube of alcohol used nowadays? I have no idea when they switched over to protect us from ourselves.

(I'll admit to being a kid and breaking a thermometer and rolling the drop of mercury around in the palm of my hand with my buddies. My Mom says in the 1940's, her and her girlfriends rubbed mercury into the engravings of their school rings to make them shinier. Nowadays, they would shut down the county, cordon us off, and have a Haz Mat team in spacesuits doing environmental damage control...)

I also found this thread interesting, for what it's worth.

Steve from The Filling Station here. Once again I feel compelled to respond, so here goes…..By any measure, this is a very unusual problem. I would be willing to say that next to no one knew anything about this issue until it was brought to our attention recently. I even checked extensively on the internet and found no reference to right hand or left hand Moto Meters.

Most of you, my age and older, will remember when we were sick that we used a thermometer that was very similar in design to the Moto Meter. I had trouble as a teenager trying to see the red inside the prism. This was while holding it in my hand, just inches from my face (no jokes about my mental dexterity please). It is a VERY directional design.

Fast forward 50+ years and we have the same issue with a different setting. Bottom line is that no one knew. Are we 100% to blame? I don’t think so. Are we willing to share responsibility? Absolutely! Our products are guaranteed to be to your satisfaction. Monty the Chev (and anyone else) can return an unused item for a full refund. Normally we cannot refund freight, but in this case, we are willing to share the freight costs because of the unusual circumstances.

So, what to do……Well, the first thing to be done is to update our listings online and in our catalog. Our online listing now includes: “NOTE: This unit is designed for and works best on left hand drive vehicles.” This will also be notated when we print our next catalog and CD catalog.

I am anxious to hear if anyone has success with modifying this for RHD vehicles. Finally, we regret the problem this has caused. We are always willing to work with our customers on issues with any of our products. Our customers are the reason we are still here after 33 years.

Gidday Fellas,

Steve,

From a sermon preaching, continual whinging, carrying on, bad namer of Australian Chevrolet owners, and unwelcome chat site Aussie, I thank you for your response and I am glad to read that the listing is made clear and will give a warning to future buyers.

Your refund offer is great, but unfortunately I have ready used it and also I pulled the dial faces to pieces last night as today (Saturday) I was going to have a look and an attempt at fixing the twisted tube, hopefully it can be done? then other right hand drivers may wish to fix theirs also and for the ones that know about the problem and like to lean over for years to come, well they can just keep doing that if that suits them but once again thank you for the offer.
So as I understand it now, there are no new "correct viewing" motometers available in stock or anywhere? and as we are coming into our hot Australian summer then any gauge on my car is better than none at all, so thanks once again Steve.

Sorry to upset and or ruffle feathers, but I was only asking a question which seemed like the correct thing to do, others may disagree and continue to keep quiet.

In the 30+ years that I have know Steve and bought items from The Filling Station, I have found him to be concerned about his customers and willing to go past half-way to solve any issue. Part of that is that he (and I as one of his part suppliers) would like to know if a part does not perform as intended or expected. None of us can anticipate all potential problems or applications. Despite all intentions, it does not mean that everyone is always happy.

Grant,
It was suggested to me in a PM from another person that I would give you a full refund for the Moto Meter. What I am willing to do is to make you a deal for your experimentation with adjusting the tube for RHD. Your results to be posted here. Let us all know if this adjustment is possible. This way if the unit is damaged while experimenting for a fix, you will get refunded. If you are successful, you will have what you wanted to begin with and there would be no need for a refund. You are covered in either case. If that is acceptable, we will all be waiting to see how you make out. Steve

Montythechev,

I would suggest searching thru eBay listing for an original working motometer that would be easier to read from the right side. They also have that nice patina to them and looks good compared to a reproduction anyway. Just a thought.......

Cheers,
Gary

Gidday Fellas,

Steve, "when it rains, it pours"... Mate your generosity has now gone way far and beyond its normal call of duty and I thank you for that but being in business for myself also for nearly 30 years I know how hard it is to make a dollar and I also no when not to take advantage of someone, and please I do not mean that in a rude way, I just could not take a replacement item from you when I have broken something while experimenting with it and as good of an offer as that is, it just does not sit right with me, but thank you very much for suggesting it, but I do not think that these motometers can be opened, twisted or pulled apart and below will explain a little more why but in saying that, someone else may have better luck than myself.

Today I jumped in my Chevy and headed down to Warragul to visit my uncle who is a retired jeweller / watcher maker, I showed him the motometer, explained that the glass comes out and that the tube was twisted a little.
We removed all the glass and dial faces, wrapped the remaining circular metal face up in a soft cloth and placed it in his vise, he got some specialist grips and tried to twist the very end below the threaded area, but we were unlucky and again we could not see any way of undoing it without causing some damage, he did not want to risk it and either did I.
So it went back together and on the radiator cap and I set it off centre (turned) so that I could read it from the driving seat...

Anyway thanks once again Steve...


Last Saturday I drove my ole Chevy 195kms but went East.



Today I went West towards Melbourne but only completed 130kms, as I started late..



45 - 50 mph easily all the way, it is running fantastic..

This situation is quite strange for me. I cannot remember anyone mentioning there is more difficulty when reading the motormeter and driving RHD. I have studied the old ads and leaflets showing such items, but not a single information.

Here is an article about the meter:
http://www.prewarbuick.com/features/reaching_the_boiling_point

The Boyce meter I have put on Solan is old. The day before yesterday I drove Solan down town to celebrate the 100 years since The Directorate for Cultural Heritage was put in charge.
Solan is RHD, coming from Brisbane in 2002. I do not have any problems to read the old meter.

Can it be a difference in construction to the NORS makes of today???

I will study this after I have taken a new picture showing the meter working, at the winter storage.

I also appreciate the question to be brought up here. Thanks to Montythechev and to Steve at The Filling Station for enlightening our minds and helping out.

Grant, you might need to get an old Motometer that is not working, pull the innards out, and put a new thermometer inside at the correct angle.

For example, here's one on eBay now: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Boyce-Moto-..._DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337dbde8ef

You could replace the photo in the meter with one of your Dad. ;-)

The ad says he'll only ship to the US. If you want to have it shipped to me in California, I'll turn around and ship it to you.

My services will cost you a virtual drink.

Cheers, Dean

Gidday fellas,

Solan - Best of luck with your findings on the issue, but don't lose to much sleep over it mate.

Dean - Love that idea of the photo and I have a nice one of my dad that would suit and also that offer on the postage to do with the eBay item is much appreciated but I could slip you a few dollars via Pal-pay to cover your costs, many thanks and I will let you know if I need your postage address.

Enjoy the weekend........

This is what Chevy Chat is all about..........


"Kindness is the language the blind can see and the deaf can hear." - Mark Twain


We're all just people..........

Have a great day everyone!!!!

Gidday fellas

Settle down a little Ken, don't jump the gun now, I may just let fly with a derogatory comment while on one of my preaching sermon p%#s fuelled rants again and the whole thing could quickly turn to crap at the blink of an eye..

And we don't wont that again, Hell No!!

"When in Rome, Do as the Romans do" - Whoever Said It Last Week

Gidday fellas,

After talking to a mate last night about the dismantling the motometer and he being an experienced machinist I was told that the easiest way to open them up would be to slice off the very bottom of the brass at the base, then carefully pick out and remove the "plaster of paris" which is what the temp tube would most likely be set in, reposition the tube to suit, then repack the brass fitting with new plaster and then re soldier the brass end back on...

Easy for some, but not for others (myself included)..

I will have another chat to my uncle, but being a retired fella he is away a lot holidaying and home not that often, time will tell with this one.

I would imagine slicing off the base would be very tricky at best...Two ways to do it...Using a thin "slitting" saw blade while held in a milling machine or using a "parting tool" while spinning in a lathe...Neither appears to be an afternoon of fun...Just saying...

Might I suggest epoxy gluing the cut end back together rather than soldering. That would eliminate the possibility of overheating it if thats a concern.
--

I was wondering if anyone has an old motormeter that they could try to unwind the brass threaded part out of the die cast upper part. They look to me that the thermometer was installed into the brass section from the top, and then wound into place in the upper die cast part.???