Reproduction Parts for 1916-1964 Chevrolet Passenger Cars & 1918-1987 Chevrolet & GMC Trucks



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#236876 03/11/12 11:21 PM
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Were all of the '27's LM? The '28's were LO and LP and what was the difference of LO and LP? I recently bought what I thought was a '28 but it has no front brakes and the front springs mount to the end of the frame horns like a '27. Maybe it's a really early '28 with some remnance of '27. Have heard how they rolled over parts till they were gone. Mysteries slay me. Any help?


1928 Chevy Capitol, 1927 Chevy, 1960 2 dr HT Impala, 1917 Hudson Touring(Undrcnstr)
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These are from my notes:


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1. The new 1927 Capitol models were launched on January 1st, 1927, and the previous Block Casting # 346709 was retained, though the Capitol series motor assembly started in early December 1926 [the date depends on the Christmas Break] at Engine # 2,874,999, with castings produced from around 23rd November 1926? onwards, for motor assembly between 2-3 weeks later, and then installation in chassis ready for the New Year Dealer launch. Canadian truck unit # 2,913,021 has Block # 346709 and Date of L-8-6 for December 8th, 1926, cast by FERRO. Hendon-assembled truck LM15451 had an Engine # between # RT2,932,700 and # RT2,937,400 [about two days’ assembly apart], but had a Block # 346709 and a Cast Date of L-16-6, i.e. December 16th, 1926. LM15971 had an Engine Number of approximately # RT3,037,800, and a Cast Date of A-10-7, for January 10th, 1927. Take in Coupe # 3AA26603 from the St Louis, MO Plant, with Engine # 3,036,813 and # 346709 Block, with a motor possibly built the same day as LM15971. A Truck motor as fitted to a 1926 Model Truck in Norway is Engine # T3,045,920 with the Block casting # 346709, and cast date A 28 7, January 28th 1927, the serial number being XB 2778 [GM International, Copenhagen assembly]. Another Norwegian example is # 3,146,563 with the 346709 Block and Cast Date of C-14-7 March 14th 1927; the Serial number is XB-AA3123. This is a combined car/pickup bodied in Norway. The Capitol series for 1927 Series AA car and light delivery chassis [10 cwt/ Half-Ton capacity] and the Series LM truck chassis. However, a known motor in the U.S. has Engine # 2,955,078 with Casting # 346709, and a Date of A-1-27, for January 1st, 1927. This Block was cast not by S.P.C. but by FERRO. Examples of other 1927 AA Series motors are Hendon-assembled chassis, AA90256 with Engine # 3,065,078 with a Cast Date of B-15-7 February 15th, 1927. Canadian chassis with Engine # 3,080,498, Cast Date B-21-7 for February 21st, 1927, Engine # 3,146,203 cast # 346709 with the last numbers obliterated by welds as originally installed in Coupe # 167730, and Engine # 3,381,023 assembled in late May. There seems to have been a gap in deliveries to Hendon for Series AA chassis from around # R3,300,000. An example of a U.S. car is Ken Kaufmann’s 1927 AA Coupe, assembled in the Oakland, California, Plant with Engine # 3,345,324 with a Block and Head Cast Date E-2-7, May 2nd, 1928, the engine being assembled a few days later and the car sold June 16th. The Head has the S.P.C. Cloverleaf symbol and a manual Distributor.

2. On June 7th 1927 there was a change in Cylinder Head to the 32 b.h.p. type as mentioned below, at Engine # 3,409,976 except for Engine # 3,410,101 to # 3,415,520*, the motors having a new type of Delco-Remy semi-automatic Distributor [mechanical flyweight as against a spring advance] which was mounted as before but required a different method of timing, as well as a change to a larger Carter carburettor, a Carter C-RJX-0, as compared the previous model 1-inch C-RX-0 [with a “C” prefix cast in indicating manufacture at the Bay City, Michigan, Plant as against the St. Louis, Missouri, Plant]. Associated with the new carburettor was an “Autovac” fuel feed to the carb, which in the U.S. was the Steward-Warner vacuum tank that used a connection off the updraft intake manifold, though throughout 1927 car/l.d. and truck chassis were equipped by Hendon with the manual spark control underneath the steering wheel. The Block # 346709 continued as before. An example of this new Head is a Buffalo, New York-assembled 1927 Sedan, 12AA60722, Engine # 3534462, Block Cast # 346709, F-25-7 for June 25th, 1927, Job # 7210, Body # 8868, with a reputed Head Casting # 354939, although this is in fact a water outlet casting number or other part and not the Head casting # !.
*The “exception” motors, Ken suggests, were for export only, rated at 30 b.h.p, with the smaller valves. This seems to be correct: Hendon-assembled LM17145 had Engine # RT3,414,189. The gap in Series AA motors seems to have ended with # R3,520,000 or so, when the 32 b.h.p. motor was on stream. The February 1st 1928 Chevrolet Master Parts List confirms that these "exception motors" were Capitol Series LM motors

3. With the annual Dealer contracts being renewed in August 1927, there was a marketing change from August 1st of what were titled “1928 Models”, or “Late 1927” Models, Series AA and LM. Rhd # R3,662,879 has a # 36709 block and H-10-7 (August 10th 1927) block. Ken Kaufmann’s 1927 Coupe had a “FERRO” Block and Engine # 3,802,580 with a Cast Date of I-30-7 for September 30th, 1927 and although it was sold in the 1928 SALES YEAR it was identical to the 1927 Models. The Block Casting # continued as # 346709 right up until the end of 1927/8 production. Ferro had supplied Chevrolet with castings until Chevrolet Division took over the Saginaw Products Company plant in the Autumn/Fall of 1927 and renamed it the Chevrolet Gray Iron Foundry and introduced the first design of Chevrolet bow-tie into the castings. 1928 castings therefore had the Chevrolet bow-tie. 1928 Sales Year motor production started at around # 3,557,001, depending on when the summer break ended: the first Monday in August was the 1st. The official start of 1928 motor production started with # 3,863,596, 1927/1928 Sales Year Capitol Series AB and LM motor production ending with # 3,863,595. At some point around Engine # 3,862,000, or about 1,100 motors before, the right-hand drive Truck engine prefixed changed from “RT” to “TR” which was intended to signify the LO/L.O. series 2-port Head motor. However the earliest known “TR” motor was Engine # TR3,862,487, and this was not a registration mistake. Two known Hendon-assembled “1928” LM trucks were registered well into January 1928, and had an official increased capacity of “25 cwt”, which was an increase from the Series S to R 20 cwt/1-Ton, then the Series X to 1927 LM 20/25 cwt. The two LMs mentioned had Cast Dates of J-17-7 and J-20-7 for October 17th and 20th 1927 respectively, which were right at the end of 1927/8 Capitol engine casting. The new prefix indicated that the motor had the new 35 b.h.p. engine, with a two exhaust-port Cylinder Head, and a new 2-pipe exhaust manifold, larger valves and increased valve lift, but in the U.S., the new motor was accompanied by a larger radiator for the Series AB cars but not the trucks. It seems that a few thousand, or less than a day’s production, motors from the shutdown for re-tooling, a batch of 35 b.h.p. motors were shipped to Hendon and installed in the last of the LM chassis from January 1928. This would tie-in with the November 1927 Commercial Motor Exhibition in London at which large numbers of new trucks for 1928 would have been ordered. However, the summer and November 1927 G.M. Limited [British] Brochures show that the trucks then being assembled and sold had 32 b.h.p. motors, but no mention is made of the power rating of the ½ Ton chassis. The AA chassis used manual spark control. They may have in fact been fitted with cast iron pistons as per the truck engines. Ken suggests that there was a shutdown of a few weeks at the end of October 1927 to tool up for the new 1928 2-port motor, and then re-started December 1st with the assembly of motors for series AB/A.B. cars that started assembly 2 weeks later. Hendon had run out of motors, or were satisfying 1928 Model orders from the Exhibition and so the first batch of motors starting December 1st were shipped to England for assembly by Hendon in the last of the LM chassis. Of course the Capitol model continued into 1928 year for the Utility Express, which was rated at One Ton capacity in the U.S. and Canada, but at 25 cwt in the U.K. There seems to have been a lot of confusion about this, and it is often thought that the 1928 U.E. trucks were renamed “National” Series, as per the Series AB car and light-delivery/half-ton chassis [called the “National 10” on Hendon build plates]. The reason for this Capitol carry-over, is that the styling of the front sheet metal, radiator, and chassis frame did not change for the Capitol Series LM, LO, LP models. That is the LO and later LP were NEVER designed for the new six cylinder engine which the National AB models were with the increased radiator capacity and long bonnet! Having said that, Hendon were able to tailor-make chassis to suit requirements and a larger radiator and six-wheel conversions or chassis extensions were available through Dealer orders. The six-wheeler was then rated at 30cwt or 1½ ton capacity which would require the 35 b.h.p. motor and also perhaps a larger radiator which could have been British-sourced. However, there is evidence that despite the use of the 35 b.h.p. motor, there was still a 32 b.h.p. motor, which must have been an option: the unit using cast iron pistons with 4.3:1 Compression used in Heavy Duty truck applications to prevent a scuffed piston in the event of overheating on long hills and gradients. Ken suggests that the domestic market trucks used a 32 bh.p. motor because the radiator and surround were unchanged from 1927 to 1928.
ENGINES up to # 3,863,595.

4. On January 1st, 1928, were announced the new National Series AB and Capitol Utility Express Series LO Canadian Series A.B. and L.O. with full stops after each letter], a running change from the Series LM, with the same 3-speed gearbox. The final type 4-cylinder Block, Casting # 348532 was introduced for 1928 Model National and Capitol motors which started with Engine # 3,863,596 [castings being produced from the last days in November 1927 until November 1928] with the 35 b.h.p. motor two-port Head, a revised Carter carburettor RAKX-0 or C-RAKX-0, and in the case of the Series AB only a larger radiator and shell than the Series AA. An early example is Ken Kaufmann’s 1928 Coach, Serial # 6AB5401 built around January 12th, 1928 with Engine # 3,910,033 with a Cast Date L-5-7, December 5th, 1927, and a Head from Engine # 3,948,368 Date A-6-8, January 6th 1928, and Block from Engine # 3,958,611 with Date A-23-8 for January 23rd. A Cylinder Head from Engine # 4,117,438 is dated B-20-8 for February 20th and a Block from # 4,098,681 dated B-21-8 for February 21st 1928. A Block from # 4,216,578 is dated C-14-8 for March 14th; Head from # 4,356,175 is dated D-11-8 for April 11th 1928.


5 The next change was on July 1st, 1928, ready for the August 1st dealers’ contracts renewal when the National Series LP/L.P. was announced as a running change, with a 4-speed gearbox fitted as standard, and the 35 b.h.p. motor, and # 348532 Block, but the motors were prefixed for right-hand drive with “TR” as with the Series LO/L.O. The “XR” prefixed Light Delivery motors, continued as just mentioned. However, the July 14th, 1928 Chevrolet Service Bulletin D-1-51 states that the 1928 LP was the “NATIONAL” model, as per the 1928 AB. It is thought that this indicates the direction that the Parts and Service Department were intending to go, but in the August 1st 1928 edition of the Parts Book, the name “Capitol” was used: the nameplates had presumably already been stamped and the only change was the 4-speed gearbox as standard. The last known LO motor in a Hendon chassis was # TR4,484,533 with components cast the first week in May?, and motor assembled about the 3rd week? and the earliest LP, # TR4,656,478 with components cast around June 21, and assembled early July, perhaps July 2nd? Also National Truck 1LP2412 has Engine number T4,787,525 and Block casting date F-21-8 ( June 21st 1928).

The changeover from LO/L.O. to LP/L.P. motors may have commenced at around # 4,610,000, or # 4,630,000 or # 4,641,000 but we cannot be sure because clearly Flint Motor Plant used up castings with disparate date codes, i.e. assembled motors without attention to when the castings were produced and delivered. What we can say is that Flint Motor Plant allowed themselves plenty of time to assemble Truck motors and then rail them [or truck across to Flint assembly plant] to Chevrolet assembly plants ready for installing prior to July 1st delivery to dealers. Ken Kaufmann confirms that because of the problems of railing engines to all corners of the U.S. and to Walkerville and then Oshawa, that there was no exact change-over point so far as engine numbers were concerned and that there was thus a few days’ of interspersing of motors. It is clear that there was no Service News to confirm any exact change at any specific Engine number. A considerable amount of effort has been made to establish exactly when the changeover took place, but 10,000 units can represent nearly four days’ production and taken all evidence in hand it is suggested that there was a period of several days in which motors in their storage racks were used in the last of the LO/L.O. and first LP/L.P. trucks without a definite allocation.

6. The last 4-cylinder motor built was # 5,069,697, with the highest LP motor under this number is # TR5,063,139, about two days production from the last ever. However, LP48228 registered in April 1929 had Engine # [TR]5,071,812, which is after the official “last motor”. To answer this conundrum Ken Kaufmann suggests that # 5,069,697 was the last DOMESTIC market 4-cylinder motor and export and service exchange motors were completed afterwards, including for Australia. It is suggested that 4-cylinder castings finished in mid-October, with assembly 2-3 weeks later, and then there was a break for re-tooling for the new 1929 6-cylinder motors, which were cast from around the first week in November onwards. Ken suggests that Saginaw cast a run of service Blocks and Heads right at the end of 4-cylinder production on the basis that it was a lot cheaper to run off several thousand components for stockpile rather than produce new castings at a later date. It is not yet known if any 4-cylinder castings were produced after 1928. It is likely that independent companies produced after-market castings as spare parts.
ENGINES: U.S.: # 3,863,597 to # 5,069,697 except for # 3,864,401 to # 3,864,487. Canadian: # 3,869,846 to # 5,066,271. However, the last motor actually produced might have been at around # 5,072,000.


The Chevrolet model range changed yet again from January 1928, as production started in December 1927 on the revised models, which replaced the Capitol models. The new 1928 Models were the National AB series, series AB cars and light delivery chassis rated at 10cwt., and Capitol LO Truck rated at 25 cwt. As before, please note that the LO trucks were labelled as “Capitol” Models: the “National” nomenclature was never used on the 1928 Model Truck chassis. To confirm, the Master Parts Price List, dated 1 January 1929, claims the 1928 Series LP was still a Capitol model and did not change to National. Only the ½ ton truck chassis was listed as a “National AB”. This parts list also indicates this National AB ½ ton truck chassis used the standard cast iron pistons as the LO & LP, and same as AA & LP. These were probably about 4.3:1 Compression Ratio?

Quote
The design alterations that were now incorporated ....consisted mainly of the addition of front wheel brakes and a fourth forward speed in the gearbox.
The emergency handbrake was of the internal expanding type and was applied to the rear wheel drums, as before. The contracting band brake, as previously, was applied to the rear wheel drums by pedal. However, on the new model, the pedal applied expanding shoes in the new front wheel drums, thus providing a greater degree of safety in hilly country or in traffic, especially when travelling at the higher seeds which then present conditions demanded.


Oracle #236885 03/12/12 05:30 AM
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One imperial ton is actually 20cwt,not 25cwt.Twenty five hundred weight would make the load capacity 1 1/4 tons,not 1 ton.

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The LO trucks didn't have front breaks. They did have the two port heads like other '28s. The LPs were produced starting in June or July of '28 and only for a short time. They had front wheel brakes. That was the major difference from the LOs.


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Chipper #236919 03/12/12 02:49 PM
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The LO and LP were rated at 25 cwt or 1 1/4 ton....in the UK at least. The LM wsa rated at 20/25-cwt. The LQ and LR were rated at 30 cwt or 1 1/2 tonners. There are 112lb to the Imperial or Long Ton. Or one bag of cement...I can say from experience!

Apart from the front brakes, there is the 4th (first) gear. Otherwise they looked the same as Chpper suggested.

Oracle #236936 03/12/12 06:34 PM
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Just to set the record straight a 4 speed transmission was optional for the LM and LO '27-'28 trucks. It was a different transmission than the later LP 4 speed.


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Oracle #236961 03/13/12 12:06 AM
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Australian 4 cyl trucks are load rated at 2,240lbs,1 ton,not 1 1/4 tons.The English ton and the Aussie ton must be different.The weights plate on the dash of my 1928 LP gives the load carrying capacity as 2,240lbs.It even says "Overloading or over speeding will void your warranty".

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CJP'S 29 #236962 03/13/12 12:39 AM
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I will go look at the tag, if it is there, and see what the letters are. The truck I am refering to has frame horns that roll down and spring mounts are in the end of the horns, like '27, it has 3 speed tranny but, motor with crank case vent like '28. ????? Heavy rearend and springs like my '28 Capitol. Maybe 1/2 ton????


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US or Short Ton 2,000 lbs. Imperial or Long Ton: 2,240 lbs.

The Light Delivery chassis was [10-cwt or] 1/2 ton in North America and the UK but in the UK the AC and sucessors were 12-cwt.

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There are 112lbs to the Imperial or Long hundred weight(cwt)not the Imperial or Long ton,and if you multiply that by 20,you get 2,240 pounds,which is 1 Imperial or Long Ton,the load rating of Australian or English trucks.If these trucks were rated at 25cwt,that would equate to a total of 2,800 Imperial pounds weight.
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CJP'S 29 #236978 03/13/12 08:38 AM
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blushThere are 112lb to the hundredweight or cwt, and 20 cwt to the Imperial or Long Ton


In the UK the Series R and X were available with a six-wheeler conversion to provide a 25-cwt capacity. With the LM to LR this was expanded to 30-cwt or 1 1/2 tons. Factory conversions were available as was a Danish-supplied conversion that was also available of course on the Continent. I would be interested to know if any countries outside Europe offered such conversions.

The UK seems to have a history of uprating GM truck capacitiea: a decade later 2-tonners were rated as 3-tonners, and 3/4 tonners 30-cwt/1 1/2-tonners. Photos show that Chevy trucks were often well overloaded in the late Twenties/early Thirties, and that speaks volumes for the designs!

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Oracle #237053 03/13/12 11:07 PM
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Man you guys are a mess! And full of info. Amazing. LM is '27? LO is '28? And LP is '29? ? ? ? Guess I opened a good ball of wax HUH! Really enjoying the posts, really. It would take me hours and hours to look up all that info. Maybe days. weeks


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LM = 1927 Sales Year from August 1 1926 and 1927 Model Year with assembly started early December for January 1 1927 launch; June 1927 cylinder head change; 1928 Sales Year with '1928 Models' or 'Late Models'

LO = 1928 Model Year with assembly starting early December 1928 for January 1 1928 launch.

LP = 1928 or 9* Model Year; engine assembly started late June 1928 for July 1 start of assembly ready for August 1 '29 Sales Year and renewal of dealers' contracts; production ended in November to be replaced by:

LQ = 1929 Model Year; December 1928 to Fall 1929 except for overeas plants (UK February 1929 to March 1930)

* I have to query here whether the LPs were '1929 Models' or '1928s'...someone with more knowledge will advise I hope. I have always been told that they were 1928s.



Oracle #237070 03/14/12 08:06 AM
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The LP model trucks had four cylinder engines so were 1928 models. The LQs had six cylinder engines and therefore 1929 models.


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Chipper #237077 03/14/12 10:14 AM
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Hi Chip...but were the LPs advertised as '1928' or '1929' models? What did the dealers say? I have it that they were officially 1928s but I welcome your advices.

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Don't know about advertising as it in my opinion does not counteract official literature, like parts books, etc. Those list the LP in the 4 cylinder books and not the 6 cylinder books.


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Chipper #237099 03/14/12 01:45 PM
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Thanks mate...we'll leave it as '1928' then, but possibly/probably in the 1929 Selling Season.

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The production of '29 Chevys was delayed past the usual end of September, early October change over. So the '28 models were being produced past the normal change over. In my mind it does not mean that they were '29s just late, late '28s.

I understand that it gets a bit confusing because of the production schedules for the previous several years particularly the K series, V series. In this case the change from 4 to 6 cylinder makes it a bit easier to understand and document.


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