VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1916-1922 - Model 490 Cleaning out a gas tank - Old School

I got a little time today to play some more with the '16 490. Thought I would drain off the little bit of juice that used to be gasoline frm the tank, so I disconeected the fuel line at the carb. Nothing came out. So I backed up to the tank, and tried turning the petcock both ways. Nothing came out. So I lifted the seat out of the way, and unscrewed the bung plug. Saw a little bit of liquid in the bottom, so I stuck my "gas gauge" in to see how deep it was - about an inch. But when the bottom of the stick hit the bottom of the tank, it felt like sand.... got a flash light and could see a significant amount of sediment, certainly too much.

So the tank is very sound, and looks very well preserved, doesn't appear to have any leak issues. I am inclined to go "Old School" and just pull it out and clean it as best as I can myself instead of doing the radiator shop and the sealer routine.

So I thought I'd ask for some advice and experience in doing it yourself in here, and see what you folks had to offer... (sorry, it takes me a long time to ask a question!)

I just did a post concerning tank cleaning.

https://vccachat.org/ubbthreads.php/topics/201942/Needing_to_clean_and_seal_your#Post201942

It does not require a radiator shop to do this. You can do it your self.

Here is a copy and paste:

Just some freindly advice from a copy/past post i did in the recent post of "Daily Driver". Trust me, it works.

"While we are on the subject of tank sealers, Recently i've ran across a product called KBS Tank sealer Gold standard. This stuff is imperveous to ANYTHING. EVEN to the acidic stripper recommended to remove it if you fail to seal the tank by proper methods. BUT YOUR TANK HAS TO BE CLEAN. For that, i recommend a combination of part vineger and the rest, a product called RUST KUTTER that can be found at Tractor supply. The stuff is smelly as the dickens but it will strip your tank clean after a process of rolling the tank with chains in it, periodically for atleast a full week to 7 days. After that, drain the tank, rinse, neutralize it with water and baking soda over night, rinse again and let dry, buy a kit of that KBS gold standard, fallow instructions, let the final step which is the sealer, DRY for 7 days, re-install the tank and fill'er up. I gaurntee you'll be satisfied."


This is for the guys that cannot afford or cannot find a replacement gas tank. However when your done, it will be just like new...only aged. Keep in mind that this is not a merical fix. Dont expect a rusted through tank to become new by these methods. This is for the rusty tank that is still fairly thick and healthy but has loose, gas line, carb clogging rust or has heavy varnish in it.

Thanks, OilSpot -

I am inclined to not even seal it, because the walls apear real sound and thick, still galvanized good on the outside, etc. Just want to get it empty and clean.

Tell me more about your procedure of "rolling the tank with chains" - that's the kind of information I'm looking for. And the "neutralize with water and baking soda." Good stuff.

It might be hard to get a chain in there much - there is a baffle wall close to the end of the tank, just after the fill hole. (but easy to roll - it's round)

Let's see what anyone else has to say, too, please.

Don't!

Yep, If it looks good, don't seal it, I think sealing a fuel tank is worse than opening a can of worms.
I also used a few gallons of Kerosene, varsol or Naptha, petroleum based parts washer solvent or even diesel depending on what I have on hand, it is all expensive, to soften up and disolve the crud for a week . I used a bucket full of quarter inch square nuts and hex nuts and bolts of several sizes from my bins, It cleaned the nuts and bolts while I was shakeing the tank after soaking in diesel for a week, then letting the tank soak another day. and then another good shaking around. The nuts and bolts came out of the fuel gauge hole ok.

I have used a mixture of Tolulene and Acetone along with Naptha or Varsol (without the nuts and bolts) for the final "get down and dirty" cleaning agent. The first tank of gasoline also received a can of Seafoam and a pint of MMO.
I love that MMO!

I totally agree! If a gas tank is to the point where it needs to be sealed, then you need another gas tank!

I say clean and seal. I can show examples of tanks that rusted through above the level of the gas. The most respected radiator shop in Portland seals new tanks before installation.

The only problem I have had with sealing tanks was in my 25 Roadster. However, it was sealed in 1980 with the state of the art at the time the "YELLOW SNOT". It has lasted only 30 years and has started flaking off and stopping up the strainer. It is on my check list to remove the tank, clean, and reseal with the "BLUE SNOT".

I agree, clean and seal. I did my tank about 4 years ago, with a 3 stage procedure, the first being a gum and junk cleaner, the second a rust dissolver and etch, the third a ceramic lining. The tank looks smooth as a babys butt. My concern with chaind and nuts rolling around the tank is they can damage the fuel pick up pipe, or crack a seam. I also used the same process on my vac tank. No more rust concerns for me now.

Cheers

Ray

I dont beleive sealing a tank is BAD but i do beleive their are products out there that dont do what they say...fortunatly i CAN say that KBS Gold sealer DOES do it's job and is VERY imperveous to almost anything. Even with todays fuels, it's not a problem. Once it fully cures it is like a silky ceramic and nothing touches it....so dont get it on anything you dont want it on! lol

With the constant changes in gassoline formulations today, sealers that once worked may not necessarily work today.

I have 2 gas tanks sealed and 4 not sealed. If the tank has been thouroughly cleaned and no flaky rust is evident or pin holes then I would not seal the tank simply because of the continuous changes in gassoline formulations.

It is extreemly hard to remove the sealer fron a tank that has failed due to the changes in the gas.

Methylene chloride is the best home method to use, or have it professionally cleaned. If it don't leak, don't seal is my new philosophy.

Chains are good to slosh around to get rust loose but they can scratch the lead plating on the inside if it is still good. If there is no rust inside just dump in some laquer thinner and slosh that around. That usually cuts the varnish. Carb cleaner also works. BBs work good for kncoking the dirt loose inside. I am not a fan of sealer at all since the stuff came loose in an old tractor tank I fixed a few years back and would clog up the sediment bowl as well as the tiny peices that even made it through thee screens got stuck in the needle valve. Caused more problems than it solved. Now I just knock the rust loose and after it is cleaned out I just use he tank as it is.

I would suggest the sealed finish of a tank is only as good as the preperation.You cut corners, you pay the price, and its easier to blame the sealer than consider you may have done a suspect job.

I followed every step of the process, and have had no problems with the fuel or vac tank. So why would I want to put back into a car, a pitted and rusty tank. The problem will not go away with a few chains or stones rattling around the tank. No body seems to want to comment on foriegn bodies damaging the fuel pick up.

So where are we guys, do we scare people away from sealing their tanks or do we suggest they rattle a few things around in the tank, funny though I never considered chains, stones or nuts and bolts as a rust converter.

Or maybe I am just plain out of step with my sealed tank.

Cheers

Ray

The fuel pick up does suggest a problem but i wouldnt think some nuts and bolts rolling around would damage that...inless it's extreemly fragile.

The reason I mentioned chains is mainly becouse that is all i had at the time and they were small plant hanger chains...not big logging or tow chains. Nut's and bolt's work just as well though. The reason for needing that is to assist in knocking debree loose and acts aswell ROUGHLY as a sanding paper.

With the methods and chemicals I used as stated above, you have a fool proof system and i have 3 tanks to prove this.

It's ALL in PREPERATION. You skimp, you loose, and it's easy to blame a product.

I do agree to the parts that if your tank is still reasonably clean then sealer is not needed. However what I speak of in sealing tanks are those with a reasonable amount of rust inside. This would also be loose rust and/or vanish. Only then do i take such extensive steps.

You know,one of the things I enjoy about this site is the very many ways people suggest to achieve a common goal. Even though problems are seen through different eyes, its all put forward as experienced process of fixing or repairing parts.

In this case, the fuel tank, which 4 years ago I pulled out for the first time in 38 years, why would you not want to do everything possible to bring it back to prime condition and avoid pulling it out again in another 5 years.

Because of this I used the three stage process, cleaned it out, treated the rust and etched the surface, and sealed the tank. If that makes me guilty of over treating a condition, bring out the hand cuffs, put me in shackles, throw away the key. What was that, someone sealed a fuel tank 4 years ago, but everybody knows it peals off, or does it?????????

But when I get out in 10 to 15, you may be the one on the side of the road with rusty fuel or a leaking fuel tank.

I would offer of course to syphon out some gas to get you going, but hell who wants fuel from a tank that was sealed 20 years ago, theres a 1% chance the lining has failed.





Cheers

Ray

I am not putting down restoreing a fuel tank carefully and doing it as yours was done.

Having said that...I have seen many more that are causing cars to die on the road because of a poor job of cleaning a fuel tank, leaving the rust to merely be covered with a lining kit of snot, and the detached lining plugging the fuel line, fuel pump, filter and carburator, Just doing a dubous cleaning job, like rolling around a section of chain with some solvent for a few times, and then rinsing and pouring a majic portion can of snot and rolling it around a few times hardly seems to me the right way to do it.
I have seen several of these cars sitting on the side of the road just months after the "restoration" Also the condition of the tank is important, you gotta know when "To foldum (get another tank) or know "When to holdum" and repair and restore an original tank.
You and I probably work on our cars with the intention of driveing them, as trouble free for many years. That isn't always the case. We do have some "Restorers" and Restoration shops around, that fix up and pretty up an old car to quickly be sold and return them a hefty profit.

I am glad that you took the time and energy to do yours right. Replacement tanks are not cheap, at least to me they aren't.

Actually, the odds are higher than that.

Just restored a 1931 carburetor and fuel pump for one of my customers and while I had his parts in my shop he had a professional Renu job done on his gas tank. After installing his freshly restored carburetor he took his Chevy for a drive and shortly thereafter the fuel system became highly contaminated by the Renu gas tank sealer. He had to completely go through his fuel system, replacing the fuel line and etc. I went through his freshly restored fuel pump and carburetor once again. He had his gas tank stripped of the Renu to avoid any future problems with the gas tank sealer.

Then there was a customer in Texas that had the same problem.....three times! He also had the sealer removed from his gas tank. Over the years I have had a fair number of customers experience various contamination issues with gas tank sealer as well.

Trouble logging in on Solan, sorry!

There has been a lot of discussion in UK and FIVA about this the last two years. Many are of the opinion that the sealer is attacked by the biofuel (ethanol added to gas) which loosens the surface of the sealer. The biofuel also attacks pot metal (even brass and bronze) in carburettors and elsewhere where the fuel comes in contact. Different kinds of rubber material and glas fiber (MC tanks) also are "eaten up" from the inside.
This both creates great risk of safety (leaking tanks), loosing money and destroying a lot of parts which will be very difficult to remake thereafter.

In Norway Statoil is soon starting to add 10% ethanol in most kind of gas mixtures, and we have to ask the authorities to let us have some filling stations to keep a pump without the new mixture. This to avoid severe damage to vital parts in our cars. In UK they have managed to get a deal where some gas stations will keep a pump for the older vehichles to use, without any ethanol added.

How cool is that?

Well what can I say,

are we that different in OZ, that we follow the instructions to the letter, and get a good result, or are our friends in the USA to hasty, don't do the preperation and pay the price. Before we even talk about Ethanol in petrol and cloud the issue, or should I say gum up the works, pardon the pun, lets put the whole thing in perspective.

1. I wanted to retain my tank that I had used for 30 years, silly me call me sentimental.

2. The tank was ok except a bit of rust around the bottom, and silly me thought, I know, while I have it out of the car I will kill the rust for good, all over red rover.

3. I did not rattle chains, nuts, bolts or any other foriegn object inside the tank, as silly me, I know thee are soldered seams and a fuel pick up line in there somewhere.

4. I studied article after article, written in both fluent Australian and American, and what do you know. There was the opinion that if you do the process correctly, the results should match.

5. Not having dollar notes bursting out of my pockets, I decieded to give it a go. Well bugger me, I followed the instructions, which I wont bore you with again, and it worked, and it has worked for the last 4 plus years.

If it fails, this site will be the second person to know, but if it lasts then for who evers sake, surely someone is prepared to say, "hey maybe this stuff works after all"

Or do we drive around with rusty tanks, wait till the bum drops out of them and line the pockets of the tank makers.

Not going to let go of this one guys, my belief is you tell everyone if something is good or no good.

As for cars on the side of the road freshly after restos, yep, engines, brakes, gears, etc, etc, funny though we dont try and discourage fellow chev guys doing thier own mechanical work????

Here ends the sermon brothers

Thats why you do it right the first time.