VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - GENERAL Mechanical - Engine, Trans, etc STP Oil Treatment

Just curious how you guys feel about using oil treatment in a 1933 engine.I use it in my daily driver vehicles.Would it help or hurt? I know it will thicken the viscosity.Being new to these old cars,I don't want to take a chance without asking the veterans.

don't waste your money

It's only purpose is to stop oil burning or nasty lifter noise so you can sell your car to the unsuspecting. I would never put it into any car that was working fine. If you want a higher viscosity, use an appropriately graded oil.

The oiling system in a 1933 depends a lot on the oil being broken-up into a mist to lubricate the cylinder walls, wrist pins and such. There fore the engine gets better lubrication with a lighter oil. I would never use an oil heaiver than a #30 in the summer with 10W-30 being my choice. #30 is too heavy for temperatures below 50 Deg. so the 10W-30 will cover both the hot and cooler weather ranges.
STP would change the viscosity of a #30 oil to a #40.

Thanks guys,that answers my question.

I found that S.T.P. sticks to the cylinder walls and the wiper rings cant wipe it off. The result,it will burn more oil.

NOT BRAGGING and not flaunting the years but of 16 years as a top mechanic and perfectionist, i really cannot agree with most that has been said. Some oils you DONOT use simply becouse it's just far fetched snake oil that your gaurntee'd to waste money on or damage something with but i myself use lucas oil stabilizer. Im not advertising the product but there is DEFNITLY something to the stuff. And is no diferent than useing a heavier grade truck oil like 40 weight when used in the proper prospective and added as per stated the bottle. And i note some antique automobile owners actually prefer to use a heavier truck oil than just 20 weight, 10W-30 or straight 30 weight becouse it adds more cushion to the internal parts under high stress thus actually reducing internal ware. Marginally but it does work. And this comes from a firm beleiver (ME) that all oils claiming to do some sort or another (which donot 99 percent of the time) is snake oil. Ive used every product made at one time or another and I've seen and whitnessed enough evidence though to say if you do use an oil additive, use lucas ONLY and ONLY fallow what the bottle says. Why not just use motor honey and gunk the engine up real good and tight? you ask... Well if you want to be sarcastic that way then i cant stop you and were all intitled to opinion. While i use motor honey only for assembly purposes now, i have whitnessed lucas oil additive with TRUE results. It's probably the only snake oil out there that actually works as intended. You notice immidiatly little noise from the engine and a 5 to 8 pound increase in oil pressure. The stuff does not gunk, it blends with the oil as "one" and it doesnt have any adverse effects on the oil chosen to be used with it.

These engines werent made for todays high end oil? True. But they didnt have as good of oils as today eaither, so why not help the engine insted of letting it pound and grind it's self to death with sludge in the bottom of the oil pan. And im not saying go out and buy a case of synthetic too which again i never use. Just regular quaker state.

The only time i can say i would not use a heavy oil is during the winter becouse regular 10W-30 is already thick in 20 below weather and fits the ocasion perfectly.

Ofcource i will probably be wrong in vast majority view but the only thing i can do is advise. The rest i leave to you.

While it was true that some makes years ago required a "heavy oil" for Summer use Chevrolet was not one of them. Some makes required #40 and #50.
Chevrolet (almost) never recommended an oil "heaiver" than #30. This is due to the oiling system Chevrolet used and with the tighter fitting cast iron pistons a thick oil was not necessary.
The higher oil pressure merely indicates the pump has to work harder to push the heavy oil through the system.
There is an advantage to the thinner oil flowing faster as it removes the heat from the bearing faster and oil does about 25% of the cooling in an engine.

I always think back to a message to Chevrolet owners as to oils

"Everybody seems to be willing to be the doctor and prescribe the type of oil thats best for and engine in spite of the pertinnent recommendations made by the engineers responsible for the car design.
Due to the widespred misunderstanding which has spread to the public, beliefe is that the heaiver the oil the better. The car owner, following his natural bent for obtaining something for nothing, redily takes on the heaiver oil.; particulary if the courteous service station attendand recommends it. The type of oil recomended by the engineer is a comptomise. It is the lightest oil with which the engine can be operated with absolute safety.
This compromise is usually affected by consideration of bearing life, cvylinder bore oiling, and piston pin oiling. " and it goes on.
I would keepwith the "book" recomendations for the most part.

I have even run 5W-30 in my old engines andit performed as well as #30.

Back in the '40's a lot of mechanics recommended a straight #10 for Chevrolet engines, even in the summer. The thinking was it was less apt tp plug up the oiling lines for the rod bearings. This was before detergent oils. The only problem it caused was slightly more oil consumption.

As a note, detergents wer first used in good oils in the late 1940's so they are nothing new. And Chevrolet always recommended the detergent oils (oils rated Heavy Duty and later for servive DG)

I will NOT recommend ANY extra oil additive (engine, Gearbox or final drive) for any vehicle if the manufacturer doesnt. Oils have only improved over the years and do have some additives from the refinery. I also dont recommend fully synthetic oils either.
Tony

The most common misconception is that the higher the oil pressure the better! That is pure BS perpetrated by the additives industry to sell more of their worthless stuff and people that don't understand the TOTAL affect of using a particular product. People also assume that recommendations for high performance and race engines will be the best for their grocery getter. Nothing could be further from the truth.

There are an array of SAE and automotive company tests that have been developed by the lubrication and vehicle companies to determine the expected performance of products. Suppliers to the auto companies have to produce products that meet specifications based on those tests. I worked for many years in a major company that supplied the auto companies and I can assure you that each company's engineers know their products better than any aftermarket people. They also care about the long term performance of their products in the marketplace. Anyone that does not follow the recommendations of the car companies deserves what they get.

I just want what is best for my 33.I appreciate all the input.

Just a couple of observations. Every additive out there has some lab test to prove their stuff works. The big question what problem does a particular additive solve? If you are trying to solve a problem in your engine, then i bet there is an additive for that. if the engine is working correctly, the I suspect adding something will not make things better. Putting on a band-aide in case you might get a cut just doesn't work in my books. To be honest, i have used additive in problematic engines with limited to good albeit temporary results, but on a well functioning engine, I would not add anything.

Another observation in this thread is that the discussion swings between pressurized and non pressurised Chev engines, making the discussion hard to follow (sorry guys).

The simple answer is follow the owners manual. This is good advise for all Chevrolet owners.

For a 1933 engine a possible substitution of 10W-30 for the recommended 20W in the engine. Use 600W oil in the transmission, U-joint, rear end and steering box. Use 600W or grease in suspension parts. Use light oil to lubricate brake components, generator, starter, etc.

If you can't find the recommended lubricant then ask here before forging off on your own.

I just want to make it clear that i do not suggest to anyone to use an oil additive. You just do what you feel is best. I just use Lucase oil stabilizer and i know for a fact that it works. And this comes from someone thats not USUALLY acustom to using any additives for anything at all. I know that an increase in oil pressure is practically useless. UNFORTUNATLY that is the side effect to using the stuff. But i love how it quiets the engine with no i'll effects. If it had absolutly negative effects, you can trust i would let it be known quite clearly and to the point. This is just me. Other than that, i couldnt agree MORE to sticking to what the manufacturer states. I just bow the rules a little.

Hi
I've asked this question in a different way before but I'm looking for opinions. I want to use Marvel Mystery Oil in my 2002 car. If the stuff is good, great but I'm mainly concerned with it harming something.I want to add it to the engine oil. Is there anything in there that could damage say headgaskets,cat. converters etc. I have quite a bit of MMO so am not going to go out and buy it, just want to use it.
Thanks
Neil

I always use full synthetic (Mobil 1) in every piston engine I own. Why use anything but the best?(unless it's a worn out oil burner).

"Use 600W oil in the transmission, U-joint, rear end and steering box. Use 600W or grease in suspension parts".

Chipper, can you please explain what 600W oil really is? I'm actually running the stuff in the 3-speed trans in my '36 pickup to improve shifting when the trans is up to operating temperature. It seems to be working better than the less viscous 90, 90-140 and 140 did. My original '36 owner's manual specifies 90 in winter (diluted with kerosene for extreme cold temperatures) and 160 in summer but I haven't seen 160 anywhere in my adult lifetime (age 65).

I would not use it in the rear end because I've converted to 3.55 hypoid gears and hypoid gears require hypoid-specific oil.

I've tried to research what 600W is and apparently its only current use is in steam cylinders. That calls into question whether it is appropriate for gears, bearings and bushings.

Are you a lubrication engineer or a chemical engineer?

Thanks for your input!

600W is the old SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) designation. In the 30s the numbering was changed to 160W. Most people that sell that lubricant grade label it the old designation 600W instead of the modern 160W.

From Wikipedia: "The Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) has established a numerical code system for grading motor oils according to their viscosity characteristics. SAE viscosity gradings include the following, from low to high viscosity: 0, 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 40, 50 or 60. The numbers 0, 5, 10, 15 and 25 are suffixed with the letter W, designating their "winter" (not "weight") or cold-start viscosity, at lower temperature. The number 20 comes with or without a W, depending on whether it is being used to denote a cold or hot viscosity grade. The document SAE J300 defines the viscometrics related to these grades.

Kinematic viscosity is graded by measuring the time it takes for a standard amount of oil to flow through a standard orifice, at standard temperatures. The longer it takes, the higher the viscosity and thus higher SAE code.

Note that the SAE has a separate viscosity rating system for gear, axle, and manual transmission oils, SAE J306, which should not be confused with engine oil viscosity. The higher numbers of a gear oil (eg 75W-140) do not mean that it has higher viscosity than an engine oil."

If you need more information google "lubricating oil" or "Motor oil" and then feast on the information.

"While i use motor honey only for assembly purposes now, i have whitnessed lucas oil additive with TRUE results. It's probably the only snake oil out there that actually works as intended. You notice immidiatly little noise from the engine and a 5 to 8 pound increase in oil pressure. The stuff does not gunk, it blends with the oil as "one" and it doesnt have any adverse effects on the oil chosen to be used with it".

To me, it sounds likes you're selling the product ..... do you work for Lucas?

Bob

Adding MMO to motor oil will cause no harm. What it will do is thin out the oil, especaially when cold. Because it is a solvent it can disolve sludge also. Heat will burn it off also over a period of time.
At one time before 5W-30 oil and synthetic oils became more available I would add it to the oil in my modern cars in the winter as they sit outside. It will bring a #20 oil down to about a #10 if you add a quart. I would add just a pint. Also good for breaking in a tight engine as it helps to have thin oil so as to flow between the close moving parts.
In the "olden days" before 5W oil add kerosene was recommended for extra cold weater starting....can't be any worse than that.

Thanks Chevgene. I trust you with your vast experience. How about adding it to the gas tank as well? Any benefits with a fuel injected car. Not harmful to in-tank fuel pumps?
Thanks again.
Neil

In my opinion no gas additives are necessary for a modern F.I. car other that a shot of fuel injector cleaner nce or twice a year. Actually modern good quality gas should have ample F.I. cleaner in it for the start.

In this country the "good" so called Top Tier gas is Shell, Phillips 66 and Chevron. They are on the list of gas recommended by G.M., BMW, and several other makes as having the proper cleaners. (as per GM service bulletin)

Absolutly not. If i did i would not be setting here and i'd probably have more money than i'd know what to do with.

If you'll note closely in my first responce, i said that i was NOT advertising the product. And in my second reply i said i DONOT suggest ANYONE to use an additive. Does that sound like an add?


Im just a respectable perfectionist mech. and machinist that knows what he's doing, am not afraid to experiment and am not afraid to spread the word if something actually works.

The effect is the same as putting in higher viscosity oil only more expensive. You have the expense of the regular oil plus the additive. If you just used a higher viscosity oil you would save the $$$ spent on the additive. If that makes you happy then do it. If you knew the chemistry of the additives you wouldn't buy them. I spent too many years researching automotive chemicals to buy most of that stuff despite the miracle in the bottle claims.

There ya go ..... amen.

Bob