VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1929-1932 1929 landau Imperial sed convt, Trim!

I am looking for someone that has one of these cars!!, I have mine all restored but it seems that there is a different way that that the trim is put on, I have mine on the upper, but I just saw one that was on both the upper and lower part of the body, of course it is the Org color, crockett brown and beige trim. can any one help, Mike .ccr7

Mike...Beautiful looking car! I'm not sure which trim pieces you are referring to as being your problem... Maybe posting some pictures would help us all out. Is it a specific to the convertible Landeau, or would Landeau Sedan be the same?? I know of another member in the Southern Ontario Region that has the same car, but painted in different (Canadian) colours. I'm not sure If he is on-line, but I could do some leg work, and get you a phone # or address if you get no other responses. His name is Gary VanDyken, and I'm not sure if he still owns his '29, as I have not been a member of the region for the past 10 years.

Not sure what you mean either, but, the Filling Station has part 357124, which is described as "PAINT INSTRUCTION DRAWING
Job #8910 - 12" X 18"
These drawings are digitally enhanced reproductions of the factory drawings used by Chevrolet. Each drawing shows the locaction of paint colors on the body. Pinstripe details are also shown and include: location and thickness of the pinstripes. Other details listed are dates when the drawings were modified and what was modified. If you are doing a show car or just trying to make your restoration as accurate as possible, you need this drawing. Each drawing is printed on 12X18" paper, nice enough that it could be framed. (Not all body styles are available)." for 1929-30 Imperial Sedan

And here's an example of your car (I think) on Classic Chevy's page.

http://www.classicchevyrestorations.com/Home_Page.php

Here are a couple of pictures of the one here in the collection.




I d not know if it is correct or not. Andy.

Andy, in June I "mostly" finished my 29 Imperial Landau (IL). Maybe I can help you, but as indicated above, I need to know what trim you want to work with.

After reviewing the info that I have , I believe(unsure) there should not be a sill moulding stripe or color change.

Thanks, but this one will stay the way it is. It is Mike at the top of the post that was wondering what was correct. I am assuming that he is talking about the sill moulding.

Thanks for all the imput, I think I have a good Idea what needs to be done ,you showed me the car with the stripe on the bottm accent line it was the last one shown, but they said they were not sure if it was right, well I pretty sure it is, thanks alot for all your help, Mike, CCR7.

Andy I am in the process of restoring the same car. Can you please contact me at (323)395-4188 . I have alot of questions like I am looking for the paint formula for the Crockett Brown etc.. Thanks Robert

I bought my 29 Imperial Landau paint from this vender support@tcpglobal.com. Great sevice, and all colors needed including pinstrip.

These are great looking cars. I know the correct 29 wire wheels are difficult; at best; to find. Has anyone see a 29 Imperital Landau with Wire Wheels before. I would think they would be painted the stripeing color. I'll bet that would really set that body style off as a real beauty !!

Also, I know the numbers produced are some what controversial and have been discussed at length here and for years. Has there ever been an attempt to create a 29 Imperial Landau Registry to document SN's and any other important numbers ?

Do you have a phone number for the vendorsupport@tcpglobal.com. Thanks for the information. I really appreciate it .

858-909-2110

Thanks for the phone number for the paint. CuChiRvn I see that you have the same car an live in Norco California. I live in Monterey Park Calif. not far from you and would love to have the opportunity to visit you to see your car. My name is Robert and my phone number is (323) 395-4188. Please let me know. Thanks again.

Would love to meet. I cannot figure how to get an avatar with my signature because the pictures I have are to "large". Send me an email or call:

Ed
951-734-3857
edhatzenbuhler@sbcglobal.net

Quick lesson on making picture smaller. Open it with paint (under accessories on your program menu). Save with a new name. Then use image/resize from the menu to make it smaller. Or email it to me and I'll do it. Takes only a minute or two.
Hey, I live in Temple City with my '29 4-door.

Jim, how small must the picture be?

Hi, COLOR? of the dash plate around the gauges, were they all one or different. I have seen 3 different ones, PLMK, MIKE CCR7

Mine's 100x75 pixels or so but I notice another 4k. If you right click on an avatar, and select properties, it will show how big it is. Wait, I use Firefox in Windows Vista, don't know for sure about any others.

How did I miss this post for so long?

Hi Ed - The avatar pic has to be less than 100X90 pixels. I make mine 99X89.

Roger

Does anyone really know how many are really left?? there were only 294 made!!

There were a lot more made than 294! Based on the body numbers of the cars that still exist (and there are a lot of them), it appears that probably in access of 8,000 were made, maybe even a lot more given the survival rate of the convertible landau. Considering the number of these cars showing up each year, which adds to the already high survival rate, the 294 figure is completely false.

Pardon the lenght of this reply.

The issue of Imperial landau production numbers just keeps coming up. It’s cold today, so let’s get our blood running.

Why are so many left, if so few were produced? Maybe the answer is in the question. There were few triple 5 convertibles, and Nomads, but relative to production, there are many today. Further, folks who bought “unique” cars, both now and then, knew what they had. Having bought something out of the ordinarily I suspect 1929 buyers, just like today’s, took a little better care of there car than the next person. They probably also passed the car along with a story that it was “different”. Pre WWII was hard on cars, but once the war started any car was kept running because there were no new supplies. A little extra pre-war care, plus war demands to hold and repair, along with an understanding that the Imperial Landau was “limited” could explain why there are some left. Having this as a preamble, let’s go back through our past posts and see where this discussion leads.

I stared a long discussion in February 2009 when I joined into a discussion about production numbers. That discussion follows. I have edited some of the contributions. I edited just to limit this post, if I cut something I should have included please add that with any reply. The edits are not intended to be one sided.

I wrote:
My IL Body Number is 1098. Chevy people say the reason the numbers do not stop at 300 is that these cars and Cabriolets are all in a one series -- something about the Cleveland plant and cloth tops. Clearly no one has the "FACTS", so arguing is not a solution.
However, one way to use this issue as a benefit for us all, would be to have this website put up an Excel spreadsheet for all to list our vehicles. A spreadsheet by year would thereby get not only a Club inventory, but also link similar car owners for information purposes.


JYD, your reply to this was:
You are getting some incorrect information. First, there was no Cleveland plant in 1929. There were only nine plants in 1929 and they were; Atlanta, Buffalo, Flint, Janesville, Kansas City, Norwood, Oakland, St. Louis, and Tarrytown. If you still have your car serial number plate, look there and it will indicate in which factory your car was made.

Second, all models of 1929 Chevrolets were under one series...the International Series "AC". However, each individual model had its own job number and the cabriolet and the convertible landau were not combined together. The cabriolet has its own job number of 8890 and the convertible landau is 8860. There were 45,986 cabriolets made under the job number of 8890 in 1929.


Pre25Chevy4 answered:
Gene - The Cleveland Fisher Body plant on Coit Road supplied - Chevrolet closed bodies to the Tarrytown while the body plant got started there in 1924-25 period.
Fisher Body Ohio Company, E. 140th and Coit Road, Cleveland, Ohio. Incorporated in 1920 for $10 million to build 5 story $350,000 Fisher Body Plant with 1,500,000 sq ft to supplied the Chandler car. It opened June 1921 and built the first Chevrolet Sedan body the night before Thanksgiving, 1921. By 1924 the employment was 7,000 and producing 600 bodies daily. Over the years the Cleveland plant was used to build the low production bodies like the soft top, roll-up windows, 1928 Chevrolet Convertible, the 1929 Imperial Landau and Cabriolet [blank plant code] the 1955-57 Nomad [plant code CL], and the Cadillac Eldorados [plant Code EP?] It was a metal fabrication plant when closed in August 1983.

Skip - I would say the IL with body number of "__1098" is an example of a Cleveland built Job No. 8860 with a blank plant code. This IL body would have been ship to one of the 9 USA assembly plants for mounting on the chassis. Since the Fisher Cleveland plant was not under the influence of the next store Chevrolet plant, I think it is possible that Cleveland used the same series of number sequence for both 8860 and 8890 production. That is the next Body No. 1099 could have been a Job No. 8890.
KenK



JYD, your reply to this was:

Hi Ken! Thanks for stepping into this discussion....I was hoping that you would since you have a lot of rare and obscure Chevrolet information in your collection and much knowledge regarding early Chevrolet cars and production.

You are correct about the Fisher Body Cleveland plant being a subsidiary plant that made various Fisher Bodies. Even though the Fisher Body Cleveland plant was not one of the nine production factories, I should have considered the Cleveland plant making various individual bodies for the nine factories. Excellent point about the Fisher Body plant in Cleveland!

Assuming it's possible that both the cabriolet and the convertible landau phaeton had their body numbers combined together in sequence, but with different job numbers, how would the total production figures for both the 8860 and the 8890 be determined? Further adding to the confusion, why would the Fisher plant in Cleveland combine the two body numbers under separate job numbers when on the other Fisher Body models the body number determines the number of the run of that particular job number? Combining the body numbers with two separate job numbers sure makes it difficult to determine how many of each body were made. When viewing the body number vs. the job number, under a combined body number sequence the body number for that job number would appear to be false. For example, Mike's body number of 8101 indicates that for his job number there were 8,101 IL's made up to that point.....but in reality that body number of 8,101 could actually mean that his car is only the 250th IL made instead.

Do you have any records showing the individual production of each of these bodies either in the nine factories or in the Fisher Body Cleveland plant or anything that documents that the body numbers were combined? It would be great if we can prove or disprove the published 300 production figure for the IL. Anything that you can supply to finally solve this mystery would be extremely helpful, since this discussion regarding the total number of IL's made has been going on for years.

As you know there are many of us that discount the 300 published figure since there are just too many of the convertible landaus surviving to date. In dissecting the production figures as Gene has done in his posting, could there have been as many as 21,000 plus IL's made? What is your opinion on the total production of the convertible landaus manufactured?

End of prior posts.

JYD, I do not see a reply to your request of pre25Chevy4, maybe he can add more now. However, as I read your replies it appeared to me you were no longer positive that all the original Chevrolet and anecdotal documents were not correct.

I suspect we can all agree that how many Imperial Landaus were built pales in importance to the number that have been preserved and restored. However, I for one would appreciate VCCA putting together an inventory of ALL member cars, so we can at least refer to that list for help. Such a list would also provide a census for the Club to track changes over time, thereby making Club future initiatives responsive to members.

OK, JYD, I am ready and will appreciate your thoughts.

Yes, it sure would be nice to definitely put the production figures for the 1929 convertible landau to rest with a definitive total, especially since several fellows who own that model would like their cars to be one of "294" or one of "300", and I don't blame them...I would too! Also, I find that this is an interesting and informative debate.

As you know, many of us dispute the published 294 or the 300 production figures (which one is it....294 or 300? No one seems to know that either) because of the high survival rate. And, because of the different job numbers between the convertible landau and the cabriolet, combining the body numbers of each is a plausible theory, but none of that information apparently has been documented....as of yet anyway. Assuming that was true however, and based on the production report that 45,986 cabriolets were made in 1929, it could have been possible that thousands of convertible landaus were intermingled with the total combined production of the cabriolet and the convertible landau, but without documentation we will never know. Also, if the body numbers were combined between the cabriolet and the convertible landau, how would it be determined that only 300 convertible landus were made?

The survival percentage of that particular model is probably not much different from any of the other Chevrolet models of the same year. There are many variables that affect the survival rate of vehicles in that period of time. Usually, the more of a particular model that was manufactured the higher the number of the cars to survive. Also, I doubt if each and every owner of a convertible landau paid any more attention to that vehicle than any other vehicle from a maintenance standpoint. It was the depression and money for tires and other luxuries was hard to come by. Most of the cars back then endured winters with rain and snow and roads made of dirt. Due to the nature of the convertible landau it probably deteriorated just as fast as any other wood bodied car. No doubt, there were exceptions however. Besides, how many of the convertible landau owners knew how many of that model were manufactured and how many owners even cared since the car was just basic "transportation" to them?

Over the years I have physically seen many convertible landaus.....maybe even more than cabriolets. And, over the past few years more convertible landaus seem to be showing up constantly indicating a higher production rate than the 294 or the 300 rumored.

A spread sheet documenting the job number and the body number of every convertible landau existing would definitely give us an overall picture of the entire total, and I, for one, would be extremely interested in the results...and I'm sure others would be too. It would be great if the 300 production figure could definitely be documented and I would support that production number if it could be proven.

Hopefully, Ken K. can come up with the desired documentation listing each convertible landau by job number and by body number and whether or not the body numbers were combined. That way we will all know exactly how many were made originally. Unfortunately, if the body numbers of the cabriolet and the convertible landau were, in fact, combined, then we may never know the exact number of convertible landaus that were produced.

As a side note....back in 1968 a friend of mine had a basket case 1929 convertible landau sitting on a pallet in his warehouse. The landau was complete. The car was for sale, and the asking price was $400. Anyway, I don't know why, but I didn't buy the car and it was finally sold and it went to California. Maybe it is your car? Every time I think about that car I kick myself for not buying it!