VCCA Home Forums GENERAL DISCUSSION Hauling or Trailering GM 6.0 engine

I am going to buy a new tow vehilce, and am thinking of going to go with a GMC 2500, the 1500 did a great job with my open trailer but at 50,000 miles it is getting tired and has a good resale.

Anyone have any dealings with the GM 6.0 ?

John

John,
I used a 1999 Chevy 2500 with a 6.0 for several years. It got ~ 16 mpg with a 2.73 rear and automatic trans on the highway. Pulling an open trailer got ~ 12 mpg overall (most highway) and the enclosed trailer ~ 10 mpg. Had plenty of power east of the Rockies but with loaded enclosed trailer went up grades a bit slow compared to diesels. Comparable or better than most gas trucks. Put 117k on it before selling to my son, who put on 50k before he sold it. Never had any major problems.

I would use a 6.0 again if I stayed out of the mountains.

I am a cross roads. My 2004 1500 Sierra with 47,000 has some good value. Do I keep it knowing I am going to replace it in a year with the resale deminishing, and the possibilty of a major repair, or do I just get it out of the way now? I pulled about 30,000 miles with the 5.3 and really had no problems. I did learn what mountains were when I went to Grand Junction. I live on a giant sand bar that sticks out in the Atlantic 110 miles so everything is uphill. I took my 2002 Yukon to GJ and pretty much killed it with that trip, I still got $10,000 in a trade in last March for my 2008 Yukon. With the incentives on the 2009's and this one paid off and warranty running out I might as well go for it. My 2004 is an extended cab, I am going with a crew cab, a little too tight on a long trip. I also decided to order it. GM is giving me $2,000 in credit card points, but I end up buying a truck with $5,000 (plus tax) worth of crap I don't want. So I think I will eat the 2 grand gift and get it the way I want. Living here I need, or will use four wheel drive, engine block heater (this was on my 2004 and is the best option I ever put on a vehicle in my life! on a 4 degree morning I have heat in 2 minutes, and ice is off the windows in hurry, besides it saves the engine a little) bucket seats, posi, opening rear window, step bars, snow plow prep (helps with resale here in the NE) and a bed liner. We will see I am going to my friend at the GMC delear tomorrow, I only pay invoice. So when all is said and done I will only have to pay about $40 - $60 more a month then I was so it is a cheap upgrade.
By the way I pull an open featherlite carrying early 60's full size cars, so we are draging about 6,000 pounds behind us
John

Decisions, decisions! Trading in trucks and buying new trucks. What would you guys do if you had to drive the same old 3/4 ton pickup for 38 years like I have been doing?

To this day, that old truck still goes where I need it to go, it will carry anything that I need it to carry, and it will pull anything I need it to pull....up hills, down hills or whatever....makes no difference. And, after all of these years and tens of thousands of miles it still isn't tired and it just keeps right on going...with the original factory engine too! And ya know the best part? It has been paid for since 1971!

What would you do if you had to drive the same old 3/4 ton pickup for 38 years like I have been doing?

I don't know I never had to.

John

You are lucky! But, you know what, unlike a new truck that is tired after a few years....I have gotten my money out of that truck 50 times over...and with no monthly payments or depreciation to contend with. And now the truck is worth more than I paid for it used back in 1971. That I like!

When you hardly go more than 20 miles from home on most trips it is completely different compared to several trips totaling 2000 to 6000 miles each and from sea level to 10k+ feet altitude. I used an '83 Chevy 3/4 ton pickup with 292 straight six, grannie 4 speed for over 10 years put about 15k miles per year on "Old Red". Still had original engine, transmission when I sold it. It did a great job until we started VCCA touring all across the country (and once to Canada). All depends on what you are doing and how easily you want to get 'er done.

Why in the world would you need 4 wheel drive living on Long Island Just wondering lived in Hicksville LI

55 miles per hour is 55 miles per hour....in an old truck or a new truck. The only difference here is what type of luxury your ego suggests and what creature comforts you require. Other than that, and possibly gas mileage, there is no difference between the two.

20 miles from home? Not hardly..... since my old truck has gone the equivalent of around the earth 11 times! But even if 20 mile trips from home were accurate, shorter trips are harder on a rig than long cruises....and my old truck can handle short distances just fine too. This old truck has probably been through more hell on hauling on trips than most new rigs, like the time the old guy once pulled a 40' semi-trailer loaded with commercial trusses because the semi-tractor couldn't get through a low overhang that was on a dirt road.

Hey, new trucks are great.....wish I had one......but don't need the big monthly payments and besides, the new trucks are sooooo nice that I would be afraid to get the darned thing dirty!

Andy,
Good point but, you seem to forget that there are other uses for four wheel drive than snow and that I might travel to other places in the winter. The 1500 series truck I am selling never had the 4WD engaged in the snow ever, but on the beach many times.

I go surf fishing and use it on the beachs of Long Island in the spring and fall.

I also travel to visit friends in the winter that live in Maine and New Hampshire, and they can get some real snow storms, and I do have to get home for work.

Besides, I like to trade in my vehicles every 4-6 years and two wheel drive has a very low resale in the NY area. The plow guys buy them up as soon as the 4WD hit the used lot

Most important, I want it that way for me. I am puzzeled you ask your question as if I live in Florida. For the last 20 years we have always had at least one four wheel drive vehicle in the house. I work in service related field and I have clients that require 24/7 emergency service when needed, so when the call comes in I have to go, regardless of the weather.

So I hope I gave you enough reason as to why I want four wheel drive, as well as need it.

I do agree with Dog these trucks are too nice to work in, but the old ones sure are tough on the back on 2,000 mile trip. There is no comparison of the quality of the ride of a 2009 to a 1971. This is not what the discussion was about. No one asked about an old truck. If you can take your 71 and use the same way as I do, my hat is off to you.

I am not buying it to satisfy my ego, I am buying it because I can.
John

If you have the scratch, your crazy not to replace it!!!

Think about it, whether its a 2004 or a Mr. Dog's 1971(?), when your transmission blows out of the bottom of the truck with your family in the rig and your $75K behind it getting any help from anybody. In fact, in a 38 year old tow vehicle, chances are the troopers are probably laughing at you as they set up the flares. When your 2009 warrantied vehicle craps out, GMC is sending a truck to come get you, and giving you a loaner while they service it. But not everyone has the equity to get a new truck. This is a funny hobby. We don't have a problem laying 2grand out for the correct honey comb radiator, but when it really counts with safety every body wants to cut corners and go cheap.

but back to the discussion...

Apparantley they might be offering on the 1500 platform a new 6.2L engine under the max trailering package. Its also unfortunate that they do not offer the big block any more. but the catch is that you need to get leather seats.

Myself, if I ever could afford a new pickup it would definitely be a four-wheel drive....probably a 6.0. Not only do they keep their value up better than a two wheel drive, but they are very practical in rural areas, or in urban places like big cities that get a lot of snow and ice. Also, from what I have heard they are a great rig for towing, and the overall gas mileage isn't all that bad either. I have talked to several dudes that have these new rigs (both Chevrolet and GMC) and they seemed very satisfied about the performance and the towing packages that they chose.

Actually, my old truck is not a 1971...it's a 1968 GMC 2500. I bought it used in 1971. And, the ego thing was a response to Chipper about how a person's ego can dictate what luxuries an individual wants on a truck....not about buying a truck.

On the saftey issue, after 38 years the truck hasn't broken down on the highway yet, and the cops don't laugh at the old '68 at all....instead, a couple of them in coffee shops over the years have asked me if the truck was for sale!

Well JYD keep on doing what you are doing. After all what do you have to prove? Nothing?

Dog,
Sorry for the confusion. It seemed like a few people were getting on my case for buying a new truck, again sorry. I think it is neat that you have something that is old and still service worthy. There is a stage in the vehicles life where the vehicle is not worth the repairs to keep it on the road, hence why there is only a 10% survival rate.

I know that stage is coming in the next few years with my current. I don't feel like putting in a new tranny in a $3000 vehicle for $3000. I did this already,with a 91 Buick Roadmaster wagon, it sort of becomes a case of deminishig returns. I also had a 77 Jeep wagoneer that beach had eaten up. We used that on the ocean three nites a week until I lost the front u-joint and burried myself in the sand up to the doors. We were at the tip of Democrate Point on Fire Island and huge weather front was moving in along with moon tide and not to mention we were a four mile walk in soft sand from the road. My fishing buddy at the time pointed out there is a reason why everyone has a new truck on the beach. My goal was similar to yours with that Jeep. Quadra-trac parts were the other problem.

Lesson learned for me, either way I am paying for it on the front side or the backside. It is hard to lay out $40,000 for a new truck, but also hate throwing money at something that has no value, or even worse having to pay someone to do it because I need it to get to work, and I can't take off the time to fix it. Sometimes I have to take a perspective client out or visit a site and when they see an old vehicle that has signs of use, (I don't agree with it) but it tends to signal to some that you are not doing well and you might not get the job based on that impression. I know it is shallow but I have to play the game also to eat

Well I am going to take your advice and everyone else's and head down to the dealer today and see what we can do with the 6.0 and the 4 WD. I am also going to ask about the HD tow package on the 1500 with the 6.2. that VT John mentioned The ride of a 1500 is great, but if you look at the service intervals for a 2500 and a 1500 it is pretty wild.

talk later,
John

Later

I say Old or New?.... it is up to YOU!

John, I doubt that anyone could fault someone with a new truck. I understand your point well, and if you have the means and the desire, by all means keep a new truck and enjoy the ride in a vehicle under warrenty, and take some of the worry off your mind, enjoy the trips and tours!
Our 2001 and now the 2005 1500 Tahoes with the 5300 engines and the 1995 1500 Silverado 1/2 ton extended cab with automatic and 350 engine, all with trailering packages have done a good job towing our cars on both open and enclosed trailers. We use weight equalizer hitches. I have had trailer tire blowouts and towed in mountains without having any scary experiences.
It is a relief to me to have a good tow vehicle. Many of us have realized that with one of the newer GM vehicles a trip towing a trailer is not much more expensive than driving a car like a 50s, 60s, and 70s high performance car or light truck.
My brother and I drove from here to Grand Junction in his 96 extended cab Silverado 1/2 ton and our 05 Tahoe towing our 53 Belairs, we averaged between 16 and 18 MPG round trip, driving around 60-65 MPH, we do drop down a gear or two climbing and decending mountain passes. The peace of mind of having a newer tow vehicle was worth a lot. Our wives enjoyed having a modern vehicle to drive shopping and sightseeing along with having a vintage Chevrolet for all of the VCCA tours and events. Our Tahoe is our every day driver, and it don't mind doing it's part ocassionally towing our old cars to events hundreds or thousand miles away from home.
Besides that, you and many more productive American workers, buying new Chevrolet or GMC trucks is what will keep GM productive and many of those UAW men and women employed along with all of the dominoes that need to fall forward , not backwards. It will be better for America, as well.
Go for it!

John,
Do they still offer the 1500 HD? My son-in-law has one that I can't tell from a 2500 but has different trim and other standard equipment.

John: Apology accepted. As I mentioned, wish that I could afford a new truck, but with the monthly payments more than my house payment used to be, that is not likely. As long as the old '68 keeps on hauling and pulling then I will have to stick with him because of the economics issue. Just wish that the old guy was a four-wheel drive instead of a two-wheel drive.

You are correct, at a certain point a vehicle is no longer worth fixing and it is cheaper, in the long run, to purchase a new rig and dump the old one. Trucks in the 1990's are a good example....they are not new nor are they vintage. When a vehicle gets to a point that its value starts going up again and it is worth more than you paid for it.....like my '68 for example (paid $1,700 for that puppy back in 1971 with 19,000 miles on the odometer) then you have to bite the bullet and spend a little money on the rig from time to time to maintain its value....that is if you want to keep the vehicle.

As mentioned earlier, if I were in the market for a new pickup, it would definitely be a four-wheeler. While I need a truck for hauling (I do lots of that) more than towing, I would definitely have a major towing package included on the rig as well. Not only could the towing package find itself useful someday, the package also helps to maintain the value of the rig on a resale.

My daughter has a low milage 2002 Silverado extended cab pickup that she bought used a couple of years ago and it is loaded with all of the good stuff; 327 with chromed headers, towing package, lots of extra accessories, tool box in the back and etc., including a million watt stereo amplifier under the back seat. The truck is called the "Black Mariya". Man, what a rig that is to drive! I don't get to drive the vehicle all that often, but when I do I keep thinkin' that I need to get one of these!

Chip,
I was told by one dealer today they are reintroducing the 1500 HD tow package for GMC. However only on the SLT with all the bells and whistles, so it might be almost the same price as SLE 2500, or pretty close.
I am going to look at the Chevy's also. I have always owned GMC's but I am going to check some prices just for the sake of it. I also like the look of the front clip better than the GMC's
John

I am going to have to order my truck, inventory really does not suit my needs. I went to four dealers two Chevy and two GMC and did a build out of what I want and need, they were all within $200, so they are all shafting me or it is a for humanity
John

John,
I have always found it necessary to order my trucks to get the stuff I want without too much extra stuff. They get you with the "packages". To get some items you have to take others. The days of ala carte are gone for now but may be coming back. It is the trade off between cost for the customer and cost to correctly assemble vehicles with a multitude of different combinations.

I think in today's world they are all probably trying their best to get the cost down for the customer. All the people that work in the car selling business (my son is one) recognize those that do their homework and are going to compare prices. Since they will be minimal deals (pay the sales people minimum commission) the salesmen try to get it done for their dealers minimum profit and move on the next deal. It is then up to the finance and warranty people then try to extract extra $$. A few will try to short you on the rebates but that is getting fewer all the time. GM is looking for any excuse to dump dealers (particularly the smaller ones) and shady deals can get them ousted faster than anything else. I am sure your GMC dealer buddy will let you know the "skinny".

It is a serious game but a game non-the-less. If you know the rules you can come out "smelling like a rose".

In 1998, I went from a 350 1/2 ton Suburban to a 3/4 ton Suburban with a 7.4 In the Arkansas mountains I would feel that enclosed trailer trying to shove me off the road in that 1/2 ton. That feeling went away with the 3/4 ton. It holds the road much better and feels much safer.

I was always happy with the 7.4 and 3/4 ton pulling ability.
I bought a small motor home with an 8.1 Wow, what a difference. That 8.1 will pull circles around that 7.4

Hey Joe,
Glad to hear from you. I ordered the 2500 Pick-up this past Thursday from my good friend and fellow VCCA member (and Board Member) I went with the GMC over the Chevy, and really did not load it up too much and it came close to $39K but I will need to buy one in the next two years and the trade in value is diminshing real fast on my 2004 1500 Sierra, and the price of the new ones are only going to go up. So I bit the bullit and went for it. I did find a 2008 2WD 2500 diesel at a dealership near my Dad in Florida that had a sticker of $50K that he would sell me for $35K but it is still a year old and 2WD which means ZERO resale here in the NE. I will find out this week how long it will take before delivery. I am sure we all wonder how long that will be. My 2004 took from Presidents Day on the order to ST Pats Day for Delivery 5 weeks, this should be interesting..... I don't really need it untill the end of May I am heading to an AACA Meet in Gettysberg PA and planning on the Central Meet in Elmira NY in July
I got it for invoice not really loaded, I was going to get the snow plow prep package for resale or if my son would want it if his new business venture of snow plowing pans out. But thinking about heavier torsion bars on the front of an already rough ride caused me to change the order.
2500, Crew Cab SLE 4WD, Power rear window, Cloth Buckets, Camper Mirrors, Posi rear, Preferred Package, Roof Lamps,
Forged Aluminum Wheels, Underseat Storage box, Engine block heater (FYI The best option I ever put on a vehicle in my life! I have heat in three minutes and the ice melts in no time)HD Trailer package $38,400 plus tax minus incentives out the door. I also like the Stealth Gray Metallic Color Chevy call is Blue Granite Metallic.
Now maybe it is time for the enclosed trailer, mmmmmmm
Later guys,
enjoy the game
John

One reason I ordered a new Suburban in 1998 was to get cloth seats. All used ones had leather.

I own a 2007 Silverado EX-Cab 1/2 ton that has the 367hp 6.0 engine with a HD automatic transmission,3.73:1 rear axle ratio with the trailering package. It has the displacement on demand feature and I couldn't be happier with the fuel milage. It can get close to 20mpg (empty without the trailer) if you set the cruise control at 65mph,