Reproduction Parts for 1916-1964 Chevrolet Passenger Cars & 1918-1987 Chevrolet & GMC Trucks


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#386451 03/27/17 09:25 AM
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Howdy all,

First, some background. As some of you know, Lurch needs an engine rebuild or a viable used replacement block. The wear in his cylinder walls are .060 inch and there are no shims left in the bearing caps, so the Babbitt needs to be redone too.

Considering that I only drive him 100 to 200 miles per year, I don't need a multi-thousand dollar engine rebuild. Besides, I don't have that kind of money laying around. So, I've been hunting for a viable used engine or block.

I noticed that there were a number of engines in an estate sale in Washington (I'm in California) so I reached out to Bill Barker and asked if he could check them out for me. He passed my request on to his breakfast buddies and Dick Olson answered the call.

Dick went to the sale with Ray Holland and Dick called me from the sale. Not only did he front the money for a block, he delivered it a few months later when he visited his daughter who lives near me. What a guy!!!

I picked up the engine from Dick last weekend. Right off the bat, I noticed that there was virtually no wear in the cylinders. Happy happy! yay

I decided to do a low-budget resurrection of this block using some parts from Lurch's engine and get him back on the road. Join me as I tear into this project. Time will tell if I made a good decision or not.

Come along for the journey as I dig into this used block and (hopefully!) get Lurch running again.

Here are a couple of pictures of the engine as found by Dick and Ray.

Notice the car dolly under the engine stand. I wanted larger wheels on the engine stand so stole two from one of my car dollys and put them under the back floor brace. Then, I bolted the car dolly to the front end bar of the engine stand to stabilize it a little.

Cheers, Dean

Stay tuned!

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]


Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:37 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Filling Station - Chevrolet & GMC Reproduction Parts


Filling Station


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Here are the next couple of pictures of the tear down. The distributor is in really bad shape. Unsavable. Luckily, Lurch's distributor is in good shape.

The picture of the front engine bracket is a clue that this engine was not in a '28 car or truck. The bracket looks like a cut off cross member from an earlier vehicle or a stationary engine situation.

Cheers, Dean

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:37 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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The next picture shows the sludge in the bottom end. Only a little surface rust.

Black gold! And the smell, ahhhhh, nothing more toxic or sweeter. laugh

Cheers, Dean

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Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:37 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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The next installment of the tear down is some cause for concern.

The oil outlet tube coming from the oil pump is bent, which would restrict the flow of oil to the oil distributor. Not good.

When I pulled the electrical distributor from the block, I noticed that the shaft on the bottom that drives the oil pump is not the same as a '28 distributor shaft. I'm guessing that the distributor and oil pump are from 1926.

Luckily, Lurch has a good '28 distributor. Also, I plan on putting a new, gear-style oil pump in the engine.

Below are a couple of pics.

Cheers, Dean

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:38 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Looks like a '29-'30 distributor shaft...
Does it have Aluminum or Cast Iron pistons?
What does Lurch have for an engine?...LM? 1927?

Andy

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Lurch is a '27 LM 1 ton truck, but has a '28 engine in him. His pistons are cast iron, but the used engine that I'm tearing down has aluminum pistons.

I believe the '28 truck had the cast iron pistons and the car engine had the aluminum pistons.

Interesting that you think the distributor shaft looks like a '29 or '30. Is it possible to use a six-cylinder distributor shaft in a four-cylinder distributor?

Thanks, Dean

Last edited by Rustoholic; 03/27/17 10:51 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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The next part of the story is about taking the water pump off.

You can read it here: water pump story

Cheers, Dean


Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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The next step was to scrape crud off the cylinder walls so I could pop the pistons out the top of the block. I used the straight edge of a stainless steel fish scaling knife, which worked well.

Below is a picture of one cylinder's scraping. This operation confirmed that there is no wear ridge in the cylinder walls. Yeah!!!

Cheers, Dean

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Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:40 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Hello again,

Time to document more of my progress.

I forgot to mention at the beginning of this series that this is the first time I'm taking an engine completely apart. In the past, I've worked with used engines, did minor repairs and got them running, but not to this extent. So, I'm happy to bring you along as I fly by the seat of my pants! laugh

After scraping the crap out of the cylinder walls, I took off the rod end caps and easily pushed the pistons out the top of the block. Piston number three is worrisome, but I'll speculate about them later when I get them and the block cleaned up more.

I got a nice surprise was under the end caps. Two of them still have shims, which means the babbitt might still be built up.

Cheers, Dean

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]



Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:41 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Next I turned the engine over and was pleased with the visual; a fairly clean looking bottom end.

;-) Dean

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Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:44 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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The crankshaft pulley came off nicely. I used a three-armed gear puller and some heat from a propane torch on the pulley. I was careful to position the puller arms over the solid part of the pulley, not over the holes in the web/face.

After taking off the cam gear cover, I discovered that BOTH gears (crank and camshaft) are fiber! Another clue that this engine was cobbled together. Besides the chunk of rust sitting on one of the gears, they seem to be in good shape.

Notice that the oil drain hole is not plugged. I think that is another good sign.

Cheers, Dean

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:46 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Well, here's a sign that is not good. This nut fell out of the bottom end when I turned the engine over.

It obviously got hammered by something. From the dent in the hole, I'd guess an rod end cap bolt made contact with it.

I will look around for any damage and report back.

Dean

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Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:46 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Are you sure the crank gear are fiber!!!

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If by chance the bottom part of the engine is 1927, the crank gear is fiber. Normally the cam gear is metal, however if changed sometime they would probably have gone with a fiber cam gear.

I assume you have reviewed the "School is in Session" recently for more tips on the engine rebuild.


Agrin devil


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Bluezone, yes, both cam gears are fiber.

AntiqueMechanic, good observation about the '27 crank gear being fiber. Although the block is definitely a '28, the crank might be a '27. I just wire brushed off the casting date on the flywheel and it's a '27! Another clue pointing to a cobble job on this motor.

And yes, I've read the wonderful School's in Session book a couple of times. In fact, I'm re-reading it now! I love the format, the banter with the students, and above all, the great pictures and top notch lecture material! Thanks again for this wonderful gift!

Back to my current tear down. I found one of the rod end cap bolts with some minor thread damage, so I'm going guess that is the point of contact with the squished nut. This is certainly discouraging.

But, in the spirit of adventure, I decided to make a bigger pile of used parts from which to put together a viable engine for Lurch.

I've had a used, greasy '28 engine sitting in my back shed for a few years and now is the time to tear into it. This engine is more complete than the one I've been working on, but I suspect it has more wear. We will see. At least it is not frozen and turns by hand nicely.

Also, this engine has its head on, which protected the cylinders, and has the correct '28 distributor and an oil filter. Good signs!

I suspect that before I start building an engine for Lurch, I'll probably tear down his current engine too and add it to the pile of used parts so I can pick out the best parts from the three engines.

Ever onward! Now I'll start documenting the second engine's tear down. Notice that in the first few pictures, the cross members are still attached to the motor. The front cross member is from a '24. That clue tells me that this '28 engine was either put into a '24 or was used as a stationary engine.

Cheers, Dean

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:48 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Below are pics of the underside of the head and the clutch plate/flywheel area.

The head shows lots of carbon buildup. The clutch plate is too rusted to be of any use. The flywheel might fall into the same junk pile. Yes, there are two broken bolts in the flywheel.

Cheers, Dean

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:48 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Here is the second engine up on the engine stand. This is a good picture in which to see the cross members.

Cheers, Dean

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Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:49 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Below is a picture of the underbelly of this motor. Although all sludged up, it turns by hand easily and the pistons seem to move smoothly up and down in the cylinders.

The rust on the cam lobes seems to be just surface rust.

Cheers, Dean

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Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:49 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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HOLY PIN CUSHION, BATMAN!!!

I am REALLY glad I inspected this bottom end carefully before sticking my hands in there.

There are PUSH PINS sticking out of the oil gaskets on both ends of the crank!!! The pins straddle where the oil pan lip goes, so I suspect the guy who had the oil pan off before used these pins to keep the gasket from slipping off the semi-circle ends of the oil pan. bonk

Imagine what would have happened if one of these pins came off in the oil pan while the engine was running. greenman

The first picture shows the pins on the engine. The second photo shows the pins on my workbench.

Man, this gives a new meaning to the saying 'stuck with a piece of s**t'!!

Glad I learned the trick of using two strips of gasket material (with some Permatex between them) and putting them around a coke can to make the arch. And then, using Permatex to adhere the curved gaskets to the curved engine surfaces BEFORE mounting the oil pan. Whew!

Always an adventure! laugh Dean

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[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:50 PM. Reason: added a sentence

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Continuing to tear down the second '28 engine.

As suspected, this engine has more wear than the first one that I got from Dick Olson.

I scraped the carbon out of the top of the cylinders and found that cylinders one and four have wear ridges.

I then took off the rod end caps, and slid the piston assemblies out of cylinders two, three, and four. Piston number one did not come out because of the wear ridge in the cylinder wall.

As you can see in the picture below, the pistons that did come out are quite scored. Also, the wrist pins wiggle around in their respective holes A LOT, so these parts are just worn out. As an aside, no shims were found.

Next, I inspected the cam gears. The good news is that they are the correct gears for '28: steel on the crank and fiber on the cam shaft. The bad news is that the steel gear is very worn and actually pitted in a couple of places from rust. The fiber gear has some teeth that are VERY worn (rounded over). See the pics below.

I am coming to the conclusion that this engine might donate some parts to the final build, but not many.

Cheers, Dean

[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

[Linked Image from vccachat.org]

[Linked Image from vccachat.org]


Last edited by Rustoholic; 06/17/18 09:52 PM.

Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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I always take the crank out then slip the pistons out the bottom.
Is the distributor & oil pump ok?
If you need a steel crank gear, I have a few kicking around. Think i have more than a dozen 4cyl engines in various stages of disrepair.
Andy

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Thanks for the 'take out the pistons from the bottom' tip Andy. Will do. I have to open up and inspect the main bearings anyway.

Also, thanks for the offer of the steel cam gear, but I can probably get one locally. I have one in my stash somewhere that I haven't looked at for quite a while too. And, I have yet to tear apart Lurch's engine, which was running 2 years ago, so his cam gear might be okay. TBD.

Cheers, Dean


Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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Hey Dean: Really enjoying your tale about the '28 engine resurrection. Thought occurred to me that at one time I had an old set of rings for a '28. Did I give those to you? If not, let me know and I'll start a search if you like. Also, while you might already be planning to, I generally hone out even a good cylinder before installing new rings; I might be able to help you there too. Cheers, Leaping Lena https://vccachat.org/images/icons/default/Clapping.gif


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Thanks, George. Yes, I have those new sets of rings and I plan to use them!

Cheers, Dean


Dean 'Rustoholic' Meltz
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I have a spare crank gear if you can't find yours dean, also check the cam, i found that a few of mine were worn down, funny how age does that to an engine.

Last edited by Qman; 04/20/17 03:38 PM.

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