VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - GENERAL Trucks and Vans 1936 1 1/2 ton Low Roof Semi Lots of Pics

I enjoyed reading some of this lengthy thread on this fine old truck, not very often do I bother exploring some of these more esoteric forums, I have a '31 Chevy Coach.
Anyway, if the steering box is similar to that on my car, they don't use grease, they use a heavy oil which used to be put in with a gun much like a grease gun. The oil (600W, equivalent to about 250 Weight today) is sufficiaently thick to avoid running out/leaking past the pitman sector gear shaft, but will flow into bushing area to lubricate properly. If I am off base, someone will tell me I'm sure! Grease is not recommended because it can solidify into a channel causing gears to become dry and wear or seize.

Gunsmoke,
Thanks for weighing in on my situation. I was talking to Chipper on the phone about this and he had the same suggestion. My buddy had a bottle of 600W which I picked up from him this morning.
I was not aware that it was dispensed by grease gun and I had not looked for any lube specs but had just assumed ([bleeped] out of U and Me) that the zerk meant gun grease.
The new bushings have oil grooves from one end which do not go through to the other end. The original bushings had no grooves. This leaves me wondering how they expected these bushings to get lubed. I have modified the new bushings to help them get some grease but it might also let it run out onto the ground.
I'll get it back together in the next couple of days.

Mike

This would also explain why the box seemed like it was empty with no grease residue. If it leaked out over years and years, then the bushing got dry when you pressed the truck back into service.

If similar to my '31, the sector gear runs in 2 bushings, an inner and outer (available from the filling station). The inner one gets direct oiling from the box, and the cast steel steering box has a small oil hole just above the outer bushing to allow some oil to get to the outer bushing. So they do not need to be grooved.

Now having said that, over the years the bronze bushings wear and instead of having perhaps 2 thou of tolerance (which will not leak 600W) if the bushings wear to 5 or 6 thou or more, oil will seep past the outer bush. At this point it was not uncommon for owner's or their mechanic to but a light grease in the box to prevent leaking. Problem was as grease began to thicken up things started to wear for lack of lubrication, and eventually the shaft itself would begin to wear.

So, if you take box out of vehicle you need to examine internals carefully. If sector gear shaft is badly worn there will be no way to prevent an oil leak. A quick check with a micrometer should tell you. Generally the shaft is not worn much at the inner edge of the inner bushing, and most worn at outer end of outer bushing. Compare the measurements and that should give you a good idea of what your issue is.

I am reassembling with all new GM parts. worm shaft, roller bearings, sector shaft and bushings.
The sector shaft was increased in size to 1-1/8 inches for the '36 trucks. FS probably has the 1 inch bushings for other applications.
Sam and I have a plan for a sealing arrangement. He will post pics if it works out.

Mike

The box is back together but even with the adjustment all the way tight there is still a little lash. The Manual just says to adjust until there is zero lash. Any ideas on what could be the problem?? He is going to pull it back apart one more time and does not want to fowl up the new parts. Pictures to come.

He needs to check both in the straight ahead and full right and left positions. There likely is more wear in the worm in the center so might end up with a little looseness when centered when the extremes are not too tight.

I talked to him today but failed to suggest he use a bit of epoxy or silicone to seal the outer bushing groove. Seems the spring loaded O-ring was not completely sealing from oil loss.

With every thing new in the box would you expect that the lash would be different in the middle verses each end?

I am bummed to here our seal idea is not working, I stole it from throttle shaft seal kit that is sold for Corvair carbs.

He was going to see if he could find a stronger spring to put a bit more pressure on the washer and O-ring. Maybe the washer is hitting the housing before putting enough pressure on ring? I'm sure you will eventually get it.

I found a stronger spring and stopped at the hardware store for a fatter and tighter O ring.
If this sealing arrangement works, it might be a viable setup for leaking but otherwise smooth working steering gear boxes.

Mike

The box got installed but will need to come back off. The pitman shaft goes threw a hole when installed but it is not centered and this keeps our seal idea from woking because there is not enough room for the spring. The hole will need to enlarged slightly and then we should be in business. Even without the spring it is not leaking but it has not tuned back and froth.

I know that my Dad is looking forward to driving a 30s chevy with a new steering box. At the same time he is planning on finishing up the floor board with a mat and kick panels.

John Deere corn head grease works good and doesn't seem to leak out. If you have a source for Farm Oyl products in your area they have another option that I learned about when I stopped to get corn head grease the other day. Its called "Fluid Gear Grease". It has the same specs as corn head grease.
https://www.farmoyl.com/portal/server.pt/community/1lubricants/569

Don

I assembled my steering gear with all new GM parts. Worm shaft, Tapered roller bearings, Sector shaft, Sector shaft bushings.
The shop manual is pretty vague about assembly of the gear so I was flying by the seat of my pants.
I figured the sector should be installed centered (front to back) in the housing. This means there is only one position for the worm to match the sector. That position, whether planned or not, placed the steering wheel key at bottom dead center. Great, easy to remember.
I adjusted all the backlash out, per the shop manual, and installed the gear in the truck.
I installed the pitman arm according to the witness marks on the arm and sector shaft. At this point, I thought that the drag link should more or less slip into place with the wheels in the straight ahead position. Not so. I had to turn the steering wheel about 1/8 turn to the left for the drag link to match up.
I hooked it up just to have a look at everything assembled and noticed that I now have an inch or so of play at the steering wheel. I removed the pitman arm and repositioned the steering wheel with the key at BDC then
reinstalled the arm (not matching the witness marks). This gives me the sector centered in the box with the wheels in the straight ahead position which seems logical to me. I still have some lash. I don't think additional adjustment is possible with the gear in the truck.
I have not driven the truck. I didn't have time to reinstall the floor boards and make a path out of the shop. I don't want to take a chance of damaging my new parts but I don't think a trip around the block will be a problem in this regard.
If anyone has any suggestion as to what I might have done wrong, please chime in here to set me straight.
Mike

The seal that Sam and I designed for the pitman shaft is pretty simple and would probably work for a slightly worn and leaking steering gear.
It starts with an O ring that fits snug around the pitman shaft. My pitman shaft is 1-1/8 inch diameter so I selected a ring with a 1-1/16 in I.D. It is about 1/8 inch thick. Next is a thin washer. I believe it was called a "machine bushing" at the ACE hardware store. It is 1-1/8 inch I.D. so fits nice on the shaft. Finally, we used a spring against the washer which will be compressed by the installed pitman arm.
On my truck the O ring and washer are inside the frame. The pitman shaft was not exactly centered in the hole in the frame so I had to enlarge the hole slightly on one side to make room for the spring to go through to push against the washer. My spring is longer and stronger than needed so installing the pitman arm was a little tricky.
Nothing really shows when everything is in place. The spring is visible if you crawl under for a look.
I have 600w gear oil in the steering box. It is not supposed to leak past a properly fitted bushing. I installed my bushings wrong and had to modify them so they would lubricate. This opened them up so that oil could pass through them to the outside, thus necessitating a seal.
If this makes no sense, let me know.

Mike

The truck has been running well, we are still trying to figure out the best way to stop the steering box from leaking. We also think that the last bit of play in the box can be removed.

There are some items that are coming for the truck, two 36 wheels and a better bumper bar that goes behind the shinny bumper. The bar on the truck now is bent and someone welded it to the frame as well as a huge hunk of steel between the frame rails. It will be nice to get the bumper put back together the correct way. The wheels will make spares for the truck and trailer.

You can see the bent one and the steel bar in this picture.


This last weekend my Dad did get the factory hitch installed. He had been waiting on a guy to make the ring that was missing. He was disappointed in the final result but the pictures must make it look better because I think it looks pretty good. It turns out that a slight move of the fifth wheel was all it took to get it to fit.









Here is the hitch on the original 36 frame.

One more thing I forgot, a month or so ago a Trico vacuum pump showed up on ebay, we bid on it but did not get it. Anyone know what it might be off of or know where we might get out hands on one?

it looks like it drives of the back side of a v belt and it would be a nice addition as the trailer brakes are vacuum operated and as we know there are times when there is not enough to run the wiper let alone a brake system. This seemed like it might be the ticket.

Sam, I had trouble keeping the steering box full on my '40 Special Deluxe. I put John Deere corn head grease in 3 years ago and had good results.
Don

it seems that even if everything was perfect the sector seal situation would leave something to be desired. We will keep it in mind for sure.

Anyone have any adjustment tips?

Don,
Thanks for the heads-up on the John Deere grease. I might try it. I think I will have the column out again for a final adjustment and will decide what to do about a seal at that time.

Mike

My folks are driving east to meet my girls and I in the smokey mountains for a week of vacation. I am really looking forward to the trip.

The truck is doing well and the summer has been busy so Not a lot has been done but I will post about any new developments once we get all settled.

Hope everyone is enjoying there summer and getting to put lots of miles on the Chevys!!

Things are coming along on the 36. Dad got his spare wheel panted and the tire mounted. He is looking forward to getting it on the truck and with the rear of the truck out in the open It will look great.

He is also close to having a floor mat in the truck for the first time. Once it is in I think a little more sound material will be installed and then the kick panels can go in. That will leave just the head liner left and I think we have a plan for that.

I don't think that I have ever been on a 30s Chevy that had a complete interior. It should be quite a thrill!!

I have been promised some pictures of the spare wheel and will post them as soon as I have them.

We finally found a house here in NC and so lots of house projects have been keeping me busy. looking forward to having my car here now that I have a place to keep it inside.

I also have my heater installed but no switch yet. I never found a new motor and the old one only likes high speed. I might just use a toggle for now until I find a proper switch and/or NOS motor.
I need to relocate my taillamps before I can hang the spare tire. I moved them to a safer place but the license plate is in the way of the tire.
I am still not happy with my steering column. I can't seem to find the proper adjustment. If anyone has some words of wisdom regarding the column, I would really appreciate the advice.
I'll get some photos to Sam in the next few days.

Mike

The pictures of the spare wheel did not turnout great so I will post a new one soon.

Did you have to drill holes in the firewall for the heater?,I will installing a heater soon in my 37 but there is no holes for a heater. My 37 had a heater but someone put it on the drivers side and did a lousy job of drilling the holes,just trying to figure out how to put holes in the firewall without damaging the paint.

Jeff,
I punched the holes for my heater pipes using a tool electricians use to add holes to a panel or box. I believe the brand name is Greenlee. If you have an electrician buddy you can probably borrow the tool. You will need the one for 1/2 inch conduit fittings. You can use masking tape where you punch to minimize paint damage.
My heater is a true '36 Chevy unit, as pictured in the accessory catalog. The mounting bolts are vertical and the pipes are diagonal to one another. Other heaters use other configurations.
The big issue is finding a location for your heater that looks appropriate inside and does not interfere with your firewall tags. I finally gave up and am moving the tags up about 3 or 4 inches. What was the top screw hole will now be the bottom hole for tag mounting. I have not remounted my tags yet.
I made a cardboard template that fit the heater bolts and pipes then experimented with it inside and outside until I found a location I liked. We will have some photos up in a few days so you can see how it looks. I hate drilling or punching hole in my cars so had to make sure that I got it right the first time.
I had a RH tail lamp for my '35 Standard for 10 years or more before I could bring myself to drill the holes for it. Now I am facing the same problem with regard to turn signals for my truck and holes to mount the antenna for my 1936 Delco radio. I doubt if I will ever mount the Safetylight, for the same reason.

Mike