VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND NEWER 1946-1948 Questions about 47-48

This forum seems deader than last week's road kill.

So, being a 41 owner and just wanting to be helpful and possibly pump some life back in a forum that should include the 41 in the first place, I thought it would be a good time to ask a couple questions about those twins: The 47 and 48. (Whee, long sentence right there. Was too.) Here goes:

Note: some questions may apply to 42 and 46 as well.

a. Assuming that Chevrolet has always planed far ahead of production, why was the loop over the plastic eliminated in for 48? Seems that the fancier accessory would have been reserved for the 48 instead of the 47.

b. I've seen red needles in the instrument panel of either 47 or 48 or both. Which cars and years (if applicable) got the red ones instead of the clear ones?

c. Exactly what engine differences were made between the 47 and 48?. I know Gene has mentioned this several times but I still don't know them. Something about valves, rods, inserts, valve rotators, etc. Not sure of the forgoing applies or not.

d. Was the center vertical bar setup in the grille a two piece or one piece deal?

e. Do most judges look for 15 inch rims and tires on a 47? Do they care?

f. Is there any difference in the woodgrain in a 47 and 48?

g. Which models had the upright chrome pieces below the taillights. Was that just an accessory?

h. Were the thicker, on one side, Fleetline taillight lens carried over from the 41 to 48 on some models. If so, which ones.

I. Other than the little "47" and "48" tags on the bottom of 47 and 48 radios, was there any difference in the two radios, either in parts, performance or appearance?

j. Why are 47 and 48 owners insistent on sticking a Fulton on the critter. It looks like grandma's bonnet. Yes, and the worse looking one she had, too.

k. Were there any differences in the 47 to 48, that I haven't mentioned? If so, what?

l. Were there Areosedans (spelling) in all body styles for both years? That is, in both the cheaper model as well as the higher priced models.

m. Was the Fleetline chrome available on the convertible and station wagon?

n. Other than most suffering the Fulton itch (read plague), the 42-48 owners seem to be right smart people? Why is that? What am I missing? :

Charlie

a- so it would look different, not better.
b- red when new. some faded if got a lot of sun,
c- Thin bbabbitt rod and main bearing. Rods required less frequent if any adjusting. Precision main bearings eleminating line boring and just one could be replaced. New two grove valve stem and caps with O ring seal. Revised cam timing for better high RPM performance.
d- The T bar was one piece and a litte spinner ornament/bolt held it in place
e- depends on the judges knowledge and eye sight
f- no
g- Fleetline and Fleetmaster
h- Fleetline 4 door from 1941-1948 had the thickrer on one end lenses because the tail light body stuck out farter on the inner side.
i- not that i can think of.
j- personal opinion
k- Interior upholstery colors went from a brown color to more of a gray color.
l- All Aero Sedans were Fleetline only
m- Fender mouldings came on Fleetline 2 door and 4 door only.
n- the boat

Gene -

n answer, poignant.

Charlie -- You forgot to mention your distain for the skirts as well as the visors.

Kiddingly,

Jim.

Charlie,

Thank you for your attempt to revive this long suffering forum. Since Bruce, (Chef-Chevy), Dale, and I have more or less, wound up our projects, the forum has indeed been anemic.

Boy, Gene has covered most all the bases.

Looks like you plea to have the 41's moved up to join us has fallen on deaf ears!!!

Again, thanks for the infusion.

Yes n. answer from Gene is

Charlie:
There's no skirts or a Fulton on my 48 Fleetmaster,but, I bet the big fat tailpipe end sticking out from under her rear bumper would get to you.

Regards:
Oldengineer

I've no distain for fender skirts on the fleetlines. All those chrome pieces give the car a streamlined effect and look real good. Unlike the Fultons which give the car a ______ (fill in the blank) look.

Gene, I ani't missed no stinkin boat!

Jim, Poignant?

Charlie

Great thread! Thanks for starting it Charlie!! Loved Gene's answers, especially "n". :-)

Gene and the rest of you who have let this one go without comment"

I don't understand the answer to "b."

The answer is clear enough but I can't understand how the amp, gas, batt, oil pressure, speedometer and clock pointers/needles started out red and changed to clear owing to the sun shining on the dash.

Seems something wrong with that answer. Maybe I didn't state it clearly or Gene is on to something else, whatever that is.

Charlie

BTW: I've taken note of the nice 41 pictured on the front of the latest G&D. I special note of the Fulton. I'm certainly not important enough to take that as an attempt to drive me over the edge but I have been thinking of "popping a cap." And, if I see one more Fulton before recovering from this latest setback, it may do the trick.
Mercy!

BTW2: Were Fulton's fastened to 47-48s to protect the dash pointers/needles from the sun? Even that wouldn't justify their use. If you don't have a shelter then park under a tree. Even more mercy! I can't stand it!

Charlie,so sorry about installing the Fulton,if seeing them displayed so often,Kens 48 and I will sell them back to you,I know you want to protect the color on your gauges...Mine are still a nice bright red,just as when purchased nos,not to mention the deteriorating grain on your dash,mine is still as good as new....

Charlie - I'm with you on the clock and speedometer needles - my used gauges are this nice pretty amber color (that I actually think are nicer looking than the red ones), but we've gone down that road before and all the NOS ones are red and I saw a couple of real low mileage 48s at Hershey last year and their needles were red...

The gas gauge, temp. gauge, etc. had red painted metal needles almost like a 1941. They would fade over time. The speedometer needle was some kind of plastic and would also loose its color. I remember these cars when they were almost new (1948's were 2 years old when I started in the dealership) and every thing was new and bright.

Well Charlie, your disdain and ramblings about Fulton visors, especially when installed on fine 47,48 Fleetlines has finally gotten to me. Rather than remove the Fulton on my 48 Fleetline Aerosedan...........I recently sold the car to a gentleman in northern Vermont who really appreciated having it on the car!!!! I would have loved to keep that car that I put so much time and love into, but your constant belittling of the car with the Fulton was too much for me to bear. My personal opinion was that the Fulton enhanced the lines of the Aerosedan. I guess that's why it was so popular "back in the day". How could all those people be wrong Charlie?

So, yes, Chef Chevy and Ruscar, I did sell it. It hurt a lot, but Charlie just wouldn't let up and I couldn't take it any more.

I experienced severe withdrawal symptoms after the sale and finally succumbed to the purchase of a 1971 Chevelle sport coupe which I am thoroughly enjoying even though it has no Fulton visor, although I'm working on how to install one just to keep Charlie on his toes.

I'll still be looking in here on this Forum (and watching Charlie wherever he may go) as I learn about the Chevelles...hello Mr. Miner............

Fultons forever........

PS......Charlie, I had to buy sunglasses. The tinted windshield in the '71 just didn't do it like the Fulton did!!! Some of us need more help than others.

Mercy, it's been a great ride!!!!

Ken,

I really do appreciate your effort to help me cope. Selling the car was an act sincerest sacrifice. And, done just for my sake. (picture me with a bath towel to my face a-sobbing uncontrollably with great sense of accomplishment. Oh, the joy, oh, the sense of achievement you have provided me.) The only thing now is for the new owner to up and junk the Fulton.

I hope you enjoy the 71. Maybe a picture here to show it to us. Not to prove your sincerity, of course, but it wouldn't hurt none.

Maybe other owners with Fulltons will see the light or be sufficiently badgered to follow your lead. One can only hope.

You're such a swell guy. You know that? Are too!

Best,
Charlie

BTW: I'm going to work on CC a little bit harder now.

My goodness Charlie........the Fulton was why the fine gentleman bought the car!!!

Here's the new '71......


More photos to come in the near future.....in the correct Forums of course.

.....and just for old times sake here's the '48 one more time....



BTW Charlie, the '41 SD Business Coupe featured in this month's G&D (page 14 in case you missed it) looks mighty fine with the Fulton, don't ya think?

I'm accually still on the fence with this Fulton thing...
I have a couple, but there not on the car...Yet. I hold'em up
to see how'ed they'd look, but...Just can't bring myself to bolt it up...A real head scratcher...

Sorry to here the '48 is gone, Ken...Hope he takes good care
of it...Oh, that's a nice SS...!

Hey Kevin,

I felt very comfortable with the new owner of the 48. I'm confident he intends to keep and maintain it as original as possible. He called the other day to tell me he found a correct radio for it.

The Chevelle has some minor needs that I'm working on, but it is in generally very good condition.

I wouldn't want to sway your thinking on the Fulton installation, but here's some installation info that might come in handy someday.....

http://www.indfloorcoating-repair.com/fultonsunshield.htm#CHEVROLET
For some reason this info opens in the middle of the page, so make sure you scroll up and down to see all the instructions.

I wanted to make some remark, but, at a loss for words right now!


Well, if it makes you "feel" 23 years younger.


Anyone with Photoshop? Cut that visor on the '48 and paste it on the '71.

I've tried to stay out of the whole "Fulton Fight", but now it's just gone too far! With Charlie shaming and harassing Ken into selling the '48, I really think he's gone and committed a worse sin by buying the Chevelle, and not taking the obvious proper course of action.

For my own discerning tastes, I find that although the '41-'48 cars with a Fulton are not horrible… they are not perfect. I find the arms at the outer edges to be distracting from the overall "sweep" of the near perfect styling. Now, I think to remedy the situation, one merely has to look at what GM did to fix it themselves. That's right… they came out with the most beautifully styled bodies ever to grace a car for 1949-1952. And to make things perfect, they made the visor perfect… and in America, stuck it on the Pontiacs! (the two piece Chevrolet offering looked bent. As bad as a Fulton on a '41!) Here in Canada we were offered the one piece Pontiac visors at our Chevy dealers, and drove around in perfect cars with perfect visors… able to read our perfect speedometers. We'll have to go for a ride sometime, Charlie. I'll convince you to stop messing around with that '41, and get working on your perfect 1950...

I like the one piece visors and think they look cool on the 49-52s. It's those other visors that I think distract from the beautiful lines of the car. Especially on a 41.

Ken,

That Chevelle looks really nice. Owing to the Fulton, I think you made a wise choice. It looks like a show winner.

Brewster,

A visor on a convertible will not look too cool. Your being a top-notch modeler, I find your comment about the lines of the cars being destroyed by those stinkin futons right on point and worthy of heed by those sporting(?) those things.

I think I'm going to drag the 50 out and put a set of rings in it and run it as rat-rod. The 41 project is at a standstill and I don't give a rat's arse anymore.

Charlie

Sorry Charlie,My 48 with the Fulton intact go no where,don't even try!Mercy!!!
Ken my condolences

Charlie… I never meant for you to think of putting the Fulton on the convertible! That's even worse than putting it on a '41 coupe!! I just meant for you to get the convertible out, and feel the prestige and fulfillment that comes from riding in GM's best offering ever! If you want to ride in the shade, I'll take you for a spin in my sedan and you can enjoy the shade of the visor…

what am I to do??? follow Ken and sell my 41 with the fulton or not seriously though ever since I had the car I have been debating weather to keep it on remove it. need help!

PS. not sure it image will appear not good with computers.



http://i662.photobucket.com/albums/uu343/kens41/290.jpg

very nice,lower it just a it but certainly keep it,my avitar pic is before I lowered mine...I'm sure I am one of the few that would say to keep it...If its a fulton,you would have to repair the holes in the jam if removed

I would get rid of the fog lights as they are not correct and distract from the nice appearance of the car.

Very nice car!

To Fulton or not to Fulton, that is the question. 'Tis nobler to keep true to your own aesthetic opinion and not fall prey to those with different perspectives.

For example, if you love chocolate, but a friend hates chocolate, are you going to give up the sweet because someone else doesn't like it?

'Nuf said.

Cheers, Dean

I'd trade my Chocolate bar for a '41 with a Fulton...

Well Charlie, I hate to burst your bubble, BUT.........

other than your constant anti - Fulton harassment, there were other extenuating circumstances that contributed to the sale of my beloved 48 Aerosedan. Get another large bath towel for your tears and please sit down so you don't fall and hurt yourself Charlie.

Some of us experience strange feelings and desires as we enter our seventies, then some of us have health problems we never had before and these things, with some of us, lead to loss of ambition and a desire to have a vintage Chevrolet that might be just a tad easier drive and maintain than what we had before.

That, my friends, is what happened to me.

Russ and Bruce.......you guys kept me going with your quest for perfection and I thank you for that. Hope I was able to help each of you.

Now I need an easier ride.........

Fultons..........Love 'em or hate 'em. It's why we have vanilla or chocolate ice cream. As long as we can keep smiling, it just doesn't matter. I'm not goin' anywhere, so let's all keep havin' fun with our Chevys.

Wow, I'm way off topic..........as a Moderator I might have to lock myself out of this conversation

Ken,I know your not leaving us but my friends would like to say thanks for all your help and encouragement over the years!Whoops,me bad,slid the Fulton in again

Thanks Bruce, we had fun gettin' your Aero "on the money".
Great shots of your Aero Bruce, even with the Fulton!!

Hey Russell,

Wouldn't it be great if it were that easy!!!

By the way guys, the Chevelle took Best in Class 1970-1989 GM at a local show last weekend and the 48 Aero took 2nd Best in Show in a different show which included many cars from Canada for the new owner. Everyone is Happy!!!

Even Charlie........

what a beautiful car I may have to just leave my fulton on after all. I did remove the fog lights.

Dean,

Not so fast, there, good buddy,

Let's put your argument in proper perspective:

I do love chocolate but if someone offered me a bite of their Hershey bar and, after taking a healthy cut of it, then detected one of their stinkin hairs in my mouth, would I spit out the hair and keep enjoying the chocolate? Of course!

Mine makes sense, yours... well, not so much.

Best,
Charlie

Ken, did the '48 go to Canada? Which show was it in?

Brewster.....

The 48 almost made it to Canada, but not quite. Its new home is in the Northeast Kingdom Of Vermont. In the West Burke area. Probably about 30 miles south of the Canadian border. I don't recall the actual name of the show, but it was in or near Newport, VT. which is within a few miles of the border.

Let's see what Fulton has to say about the sunvisor.

Charlie this is for you.....Are you happy now????

I will bet the car pictured is Mr. Fultons 1947 Cadillac.

Gene,

Mr Fulton would never have stuck one of his visor on any car. I bet he laughed and shook his head every time he went to the bank.

CC,

That is a right pretty car. Rivaling a 41 Master Deluxe four-door sedan.

I wonder what a 41 would have looked like had it been adorned with some beautiful wood like the pictured 42. (who can tell the year? 42-48 all looked the same from the side. Do too!)

It is important to note that the use of beautiful wood is necessary to even approach the beauty of a 41.

Question: Was the wood laden Chevrolet pictured a production car or was the wood kit a factory option or neither? Owing to the wall-flower appearance of the 42-48 they should have sold many with the wood or sold many accessory kits, whatever.

Thanks for the photograph, CC. A very nice looking car indeed. (It really hurt to utter that. Did too!) I hope no stinkin Fulton is ever consider for it. It would be a true shame to put one on it. Would too!

Charlie

I couldn't have you all fooled????Same car as on page 3 of this thread..."IS TOO"

Please note: This is a long piece on Fultons. If you like Fultons please don't read it. It will only annoy you and do nothing to persuade you in any way. I want to be your friend. Do too! As in all adventure stories into the unknown wilderness (of Fulton jungles) I bring you salt. Salt lick for Canadains. Just kidding. Read on at your own risk.

CC,

It may very well be the same car. The later picture shows a much darker color to the wood and it appears there is no Fulton. Those two factors make the car look much better.

BTW: I read all that propaganda in the Fulton ad. Now, I ask you, is that evidence of good advertising or not? Lower temperature in the cabin, less dazzle (whatever that is), no squinting, etc. No proof in advertising back in the day. Right?

Did it mention that you couldn't see traffic lights and the danger that fault posed? No. Did the ad mention that the contraption destroyed the lines of the car? No. Did the ad mention that the visor looked like it had been fabricated from scrap tin? No, again. Did the ad mention that if one was not too dad-burned lazy there was an internal visor that served just as well and could flipped up out of sight when not needed? Well, Nooo to that too.

With an ad writer of that caliber one could sell life preservers to a duck.

BTW: I have done a study and have arrived at this conclusion: The percentage of Fulton users is in inverse proportion to IQ. The bell curve indicated that on the right, outside end of those opposing the Fulton was brain surgeons, artists, bankers, CEOs, attorneys.

The left end embracing (with hoops of steel" the concept and desire for the Fultons was Kindergarten dropouts, shoe shine boys, bell hops and Canadians. All the rest fell somewhere under the umbrella of the 66 percent category skewed along appropriate ends. The study was obviously conducted scientifically with attending test and measures. Was too!

Sorry to bust your bubble but it appears from the study that the informed just shake their heads in wander whenever they see a Fulton on a car, whilst the uninformed lower caste attain a high level of elation, salivate profusely with awe and unconfined glee, spill their Mountain Dews and pee in their pants.

Visors on cars prior to 1950 should not be allowed on the show field. They should be taken off and the owner given a claim check. The visors could then be tossed in a Dumpster for safe-keeping. Like one would do with "a hat without a brim." Get it?

Its reasonable to assume that upon some later conversation with participants at the show that some visors would not, to avoid embarrassment, be reclaimed. But if that development were to occur it would be ok with the show sponsors because the visors would already be in the trash Dumpster where they belong in the first place. Oh, yes!

Charlie

Some times I get the feeling that Charlie doesn't like Fulton visors

Gene

Charlie,your one funny guy!!!!ARE TOO!!!!

Cheffy, that is one, nice looking Fleetline!

Thanks Steve and also for the 1st senior...See you again next year if not sooner

What is this between Novasscott (NS) and CC.

Why the icon.

Wasn't NS complementing the car and not CC. Hmm. Interesting turn of words.

And CC's thanks for the trophy. Didn't the car win it fair and square? wouldn't an been more appropriate?

All that sweetness between these two (one a competitor and the Fulton owner and the other a judge) is not lost on the rest of us.

CC does have a nice looking car but we haven't seen what competition it was up against. Maybe some of the others didn't have a fake trunk handle as did CC. Did CC get a pass from the loving judge (NS?)? Now, I ain't saying he did, mind you.

Talk about those stinkin 46-48ers sticking together, without more, this takes the cake. (NS probably has one hidden somewhere) What's going on here?

Given the two posts, should we be suspicious of some degree of favorability? I don't think so but that and the return "thanks for the trophy" congers up all kind of dark thoughts. Does too!

Charlie

BTW: This was all in jest. Sorta.

Hey Charlie, from Steve's profile.

Bruce, have you received you judging sheet yet?

Charlie, my Pops (NovaSScott) used to own a '47 & 48 Fleetline Sportmaster and a '47 Stylemaster Business Coupe. He also brought my '47 back to life. I guess you could say he has a lot of for those cars. While he doesn't own one, I'm sure he would love to add an Aerosedan to his collection one day.

Here's the '48 Fleetline circa 1991.




And here's the '47 Fleetline a few years ago.




I assure you nobody on the judging committee is on the take here, but if bribery is being considered...then payment in car parts would suffice.




Just kidding. The VCCA has morals!

Charlie, Charlie, Charlie...........must not be anything going on in the 1937-42 Forum with you spending all your time here in the 46-48 Forum. If I knew you had such a hankerin' for these 46-48s, I would have called you before I sold my 48 Aero and given you the chance to join this group as a true admirer and owner.....I might have even taken off the Fulton if you really wanted the Aero!! I can see your for these stylish beauties.......and remember, jealousy will get you nowhere

Charlie,I am sure you have been waiting for my retaliation..Well it is real simple.................

Steve did not judge my car but is on the national commitee and had set me the judging results for my 48...I was very happy with the judging results"maybe"but ultimately the 1st senior and I was basicly thanking him for the judging sheet in general
...
Sorry Charlie to be the bearer of bad news I did quite well in the eyes of the judges,cc

CC,

I'm sure everything was up and up. Just trying to keep the ball rollin. Didn't mean to imply anything beyond the kidding factor.

While I like your woody car, I do think it would look even better without the fulton and with darker wood. Other than that I dont think there could be much improvement. Very nice indeed.

How is your car model said:

Fleetline Two-door Aerosedan, or

Two-door Aerosedan fleet line, or

Aerosedan Two-door Fleetline, or

Aerosedan Fleetline Two door?

How is it distinguished from an Aero Four door?

And why didn't the convertible and station wagon get the fleet line treatment?

46-48 had more models than you could shake a stick at. Did too! And, owing to the sloped line, most everyone called an aero sedan a fleet line whether it was or not.

Charlie

models

Just plain Fleetline Aerosedan. No need for "two-door"

No such thing!


???????????


Wanted to please everybody!!

There were only two Fleetline models for 1946-1948.
The 2 door was a Fleetline Aerosedan.
The 4 door was a Fleetline Sportmaster.

The station wagon and convertible were Fleetmasters

In 1941 and 1942 the Fleetline was a subseries of the Special Deluxe.

In later 1942 after production stopped the Master Deluxe was renamed a Stylemaster, Special Deluxe a Fleetmaster, and the Fleetline became a seperate line of its own.

Thanks Gene, that's simple enough.

I learned from the Fleetline clutter thread that there was a difference in the side chrome from a 47 to 48. I thought they were the same except for ugly "T" in the grill of the 48 and the 47s better looking hood ornament with the bridge over the plastic insert. Sort of like a Band-aid over one's nose to hide a pimple but a little nicer effect on the 47.

Some nice looking 47-48 Fleetlines shown there (oh, mercy. it did hurt to say that) but a couple had Fultons and a couple without fender skirts. No 46ers. Wonder why?

The cars could have been improved with the elimination of the former and the addition of the latter. Such oversights boggle the mind until one realizes we're dealing with stick-together 46-48ers. That explains a lot.

Charlie :computer

BTW: The best looking 46-48s are Brewsters models. Shrinking the size apparently covers many flaws in design. Does too!

BTW2: Are 46s considered the "red-headed" step-child of the 46-48 Forum? Are they ever invited to the party? Not enough interchangeable parts in the grille? Blue nose horn ornament? Hmmm.