VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1933-1936 More 207 questions

As I was getting set to install the dippers, I noticed that the engine man installed the rods with the pin bolt away from the camsfaft side. The book says they should be towards the camshaft. Is that critical? If so, what is the easiest way to rectify the situation?
-Lift the crankshaft & rotate the pistions in their bore?
-Leave the crankshaft there put pull the pistons instead?

Also, the pilot bearing I obtained from FS has an open side and a sealed side. Which side should face the engine? Or does it matter?

Yes, I think that it is critical, not sure which way would be best but I would remove the pistons and put them back in the correct way.

Hi Pat

You need to rotate the rods, don't leave them pointed away from the cam, it's a trust and stress thing. Anyway I think you can just unbolt the rod cap and rotate it 180 degrees and put the rod cap back on keeping the cap and rod aligned the way they were. The rings will stay right where they are in the bore and the piston will just rotate. Don't take them out of the bore, there is no need. It should not hurt anything.

Dale is right, that would be a lot easier, I guess I just was worried about the rings staying put in the bore and the piston rotating around them, but it shouldn't really be a problem. I see no need to remove the crankshaft, just rotate it so the throes are down on the ones you are working on and push the pistons far enough up so you can turn the rods without hitting the crank. Sounds like your engine man needed your book. Make sure you get the rod caps back on correctly and check that your engine guy did too, that is also critical.

A collar of vinyl or rubber tubing over the rod bolts is good insurance against hitting and burring the crank bearing surface.

The worst thing is, he had the book. I tried just undoing the cap and turning the rod but there is no clearance.I'll try again, maybe I had the crank in the wrong position.

I did the "dippers" search and saw Gene's grease trick. What about the oil lines? There's a lot of talk about the "nozzles" but that looks like a 216 and later feature. Does one "aim" the line by measurement alone?

Just came back from the shop. The pistons can be turned in the bore, however that brings the part of the piston merked "front" towards the back.Looks like I'll have to pull them all and reverse the rods in the pistons asell. I put one back on with the dipper and that seems to have made the engine tighter. I torqued it at 40 ft/lbs.

You should take the engine back and have your engine man correct his mistake.

Pat, If the shop that did the engine work Is not too far, I would take the engine back and let them correct the problem. It will also prevent them from blaming you If something goes wrong on start up.
Richard

Guess JYD and I were typing at the same time!

Pat, Sorry to hear of your problems. Don't you love it when you take something to a so called proffessional and the have to redo everything when you get it home? I would check all the ring gaps, rod clearances, etc. He may not have been any better at that than he was about getting the rods in correctly. As far as the oil pipes, just make sure they will fill the oil troughs OK. You are right, the 216's have the nozzle that is supposed to squirt the oil at the rod dippers, the 206/207 doesn't have that feature, they just dip the oil out of the trough. Take your time and use common sense and it will be fine.

Good Luck

Excellent point!

I guess a bunch of us were all typing at the same time. Yes he should correct the problem, but with that shabby work do you trust him to do any of it right and will they stand behind the work if it does go bad at start up?

Hi
I didn't think about the pistons being marked "Front". Not all pistons have a front marked on them. That being said I would do as all the others have suggested and take it back. If you have the time, ask to watch him do the work, be careful not to break a ring!

The 207 pistons do not have an offset pin so there is no difference if rotated. The piston sets that I looked at do not have and indication of front. Some have letters stamped in the tops but those are weight ranges so the factory could package them with closer individual weights.

I still would take the engine back for the rebuilder could redo his work. Of course that assumes that you trust him to do the work after what you have already found. The other side of the coin is that we all make mistakes so one occasionally is not justification to distrust people.

One other note: If the pistons are aluminum make sure that the slot is opened all the way to the bottom of the skirt. Some manufacturers only make the cut part way through so machining can be more accurate and the parts are less likely to be damaged in storage and shipping. I have sold two sets to a couple of people because their "experienced" rebuilders did not know to open the slot and the pistons locked in the cylinders after only running a few miles.

Thanks everyone. I will take it back.Those pistons have "front" punched on the top and the ones where it was faint had an arrow made with a marker. I checked the pistons after I read Chipper's post above. The slots end in a round hole about 3/4" from the bottom of the skirt. How are they opened up?

As far as trusting him I do because everybody says he's the best around here. I had told him to follow the manual, but he probably thought he didn't need to. I can see how that can happen. The shop is spotless and everything is neat and tidy and each project is wrapped in heavy clear plastic. I will give him the benefit of the doubt.

Pat, Sounds like the guy is probably OK if he is that fussy about his shop, I'd probably give him another chance too.

Chipper, I have never heard of opening up the slot, are all aluminum pistons that way? The reason I ask is that I have 2 sets of them in service for about 30 years now and I didn't do anything to them, but maybe they are not all, or were not all like that?

I don't know if all require the slot to be extended to bottom of skirt or not. The sets I have are NORS and have a sheet packed with them to finish cutting the slot. Modern aluminum pistons may have different alloy that does not require modifying the slot once pistons are installed on rods.

Thanks Chipper, I don't think the ones I have said that, but it's been a long time ago since I put them in! lol

Be sure to read this.............

There is a front and back to your pistons. The T slot must be on the proper side so it is important for the front to be to the front.
When the rods are turned around MAKE SURE the rod caps are facing the correct directoon also. The hole in the cap for the dipper oil to get into the bearing must be away from the opening of the dipper.
If the caps were installed the correct way and the rods backwards they must be readjusted.....
The rods must be adjusted with the caps corrrectly installed.
The 1934 engine does not have the rod pipes in the pan but the pipes on the side of the block must be aligned with the oil
gutters" running down the side of the pan to the oil troughs.

Pat,
Read chevgenes' post carefully, it is all correct and well said!

Thanks Gene. It's a good thing you bring the hole in the cap up. I would have installed them backwards against the advice of the rebuilder. I argued it should line up with the hole in the dipper.He was adamant that the cap had been installed in the position it came in. So we'll turn the pistons on the rods, the rods on the crankshaft and everything will be OK. Thank the Lord for you guys and for there being a pontoon boat in the engine shop that prevented me from unloading the engine yesterday. He does act in strange ways.

Took it back today. Went over everything with him. Looks like we're on the right track.

Glad everything seems to be getting fixed. Most reputable people appreciate the opportunity to fix problems. Too many assume otherwise and it just creates unnecessary bad feelings.

She's a done deed. Pistons in the right direction. Wristpin nut, dippers, cap holes all in the right direction. Now on with the rest. I'll have many more questions during the reassembly. Please bear with me.