VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 235 and 216 Engines

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It looks like it's in pretty good shape. The trim and stainless look good. The faded paint looks to be Seafoam Green? That's the colour mine was from the factory as well.

Hello Roger:
On Page 43 of the 2008 Blue Cover Judging Manual, it says:

" A vehicle with the correct displacement but wrong year will receive a mandatory 15 point deduction".

What page did you find a reference to a 30 point mandatory deduction?

dtm

I took that quote from the on line version found on this site, which is on page 46, if I remembered correctly. I just looked at the 2008 blue book copy I have and your quote of 15 points is on page 43. Maybe someone can inform us which one is correct.

Roger

Hi wawuzit,
I dont agree with your comment above about 12 volt and radial tires.

My "new" old 1940 chevy is now on the ocean on the ship, coming to germany. Here we have laws. The car must have headlights in german system, and the only easy way to change the headlights without big trouble is to use headlamps from for ex. VW "rabbit", or BMW E 30 type, means 323 model around 1995. Just the old round ones. Exactly same size, easy to change, but they are only available in 12 volt Halogen H4 system bulbs. So I must convert to 12 volt. Otherwise the car will never get a license to use it on public roads. Hard laws, but they exist and I must follow.
The other thing, radial tires. Dont forget, you are on the road together with modern cars with perfect brakes, perfect tires, and you come along with your rolling museum.
I guess, you might get involved in dangerous situations faster than you expect, and if you crash your car because of weak, oldfashioned tires, your car will be gone and it will not help to say "But I still had the original tires!" after.

Conclusion: If I do moderate changings giving me much more saftety and a real chance to survive in todays traffic with a vintage car, I will never say "no!". I am not James Bond and may not live twice.
Same with seat belts. My father did survive a crash with a 1960 VW beetle without any injuries because he did install aftermarket seatbelts and use it. Otherwise he would have passed by.
So, for me, in general, to use a vintage car in today traffic must include moderate changings for safety, only a car just sitting in a museum may remain original.
That's my point of sight.

All the best
Stefangermany

I was being sarcastic(teasing). I can't image being on one of Germanys super highways with 6volt lights or orginal tires. I haven't gone to 12volt because I use halogen lights,which are a little better but not much, but I do have radials and will have seat belts soon. Some of the hardcore owners don't want to update anything. I understand where you are coming from. Sorry for my comments. I agree with you completely,if you are going to drive it you need to be safe and within the laws.

That is the time I have read an actual account of someone benefiting from the installation of after market seatbelts. I know that they must have helped in many cases, it just isn't written about.

When I was a kid, one of our friends lost their daughter when the tube type tire blew out on the back of their big Buick. That is why I like to convert to tubeless tires if at all possible.

Mr Mack,
I took your suggestion. I never thought to look there. Imagine that.
Thanks,
Charlie

BTW: I hope things are going great for you."

My question is....Did you find what you wanted to know?
Sometimes I have been kind of questionable about the VCCA Judging policy from comments that should be a good source of info, but they are different than the rules, I guess that isn't confined to VCCA judging, look how the present Washington crowd is interpeting the Constitution, EH?

MrMack,
Well, I think so. Some of it on the engine language is a little vague. I guess it is up to the owner to make a declaration as to the engine number on the shelf behind the distributor. Why do that? That tells me that it won't be personally checked by the judges. It implies that they will take one's word for it. Else, why the declaration. But, I may be wrong. (I'm gonna stick the 261 in and then stretch the truth a little. Grin.)

I noted the part about the paint. It seems that the Club "encourages" the color that is on the data plate but that other colors available for that model year are acceptable. Why encourage it if it doesn't mean anything? I think some points should be deducted for a color other than that on the data plate. And, I would probably be pinged for it, if I had a show car, because I am thinking of painting my original black car ruby maroon. Just my opinion.

I'm going to download the judging data, scrutinize it and, maybe, make some recommendations, etc.
Charlie

I've always wondered if two cars are tied when it comes to awarding a first, does the data plate become that much more important? Do they ignore the "wrong" colour unless it means something at the awards table?

The paint number on the plate is not considered....not ever for VCCA judging. This is the way it all began 50 years ago.
As far as correct color is concerned the door is wide open. Often colors are quite a bit off and no one knows the difference. The 1941 maroon is a good example. Its never found to be as dark as the original was in 1941.

The data plate contains a world of information for judging and the VCCA, for whatever reason, has ignored that information for 50 years. The statement about a tie in points is well taken, but even then...the judges will still ignore the date plate per VCCA rules.

The club has now gone into cyber-space, and with that it's about time that the VCCA gets out of the dark and start using the information that is on the date plate as part of the judging process.

There is a dipper 235 that looks identical to a 216 and I think it was made from 41 to 48? and then it got the small side cover when it was put in front of a powerglide,I am thinking about tryng to find one and installing 261 guts and converting to full pressure to really confuse people at shows. I want to do this with my 37 p/u and have it painted up like it still had the original 216 but adapting a 2 bbl carb from a pontiac,buick straight 8 or GMC 302 would give it away that something is just not right if they did not hear the hot cam in the motor when I pulled up.