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Featured in the new G&D...Great article Dick!! Way to go 46-48  and of course Tiny's continuing saga, great stuff
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Those kits used to be so rare. Now when you watch eBay they seem to come up all of the time. Likely people recreating them new, in an effort to cash in on the premium... Too bad for the people that have the original ones.
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Brewster, the only thing that I feel bad about with owning an original kit is that I never saved the box...Whoops...I do have the installation manual though
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In reading the articles, one stated the kit was not available in '47 that it came in '48 though it obviously would fit the'47. Another article stated, was a dealer installed option available in '47 and '48. Which is correct????? Now, KUDOS to all! Best G&D ever! Really great to see Dick's super nice cars.  Oh, kinda' feel bad for ol' Charlie though. Maybe he won't get too down reading about all the fine '47's,'48's.
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In reading the articles, one stated the kit was not available in '47 that it came in '48 though it obviously would fit the'47. Another article stated, was a dealer installed option available in '47 and '48. Which is correct????? Yep, I saw that too. I would go with what the editor of the G&D stated in her article because Kate is really a stickler for accurate research.   
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The kit was not a dealer installed option (that should read accessory).....it was an aftermarket item that was sold to dealers by a non-Chevrolet company. It was NEVER listed in any Chevrolet literature, etc.
The dealers were the main outlet as it was not really a product that would be installed by john Q public. There were several things in 1948 like a Fulton visor and the "tube" front grille guard. 1948 was one of the last years that the dealers could really load up a new car with accessories as the 1948 chevrolet was still in rather short supply.
Last edited by Chev Nut; 10/28/15 06:13 PM.
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The kit was not a dealer installed option (that should read accessory).....it was an aftermarket item that was sold to dealers by a non-Chevrolet company. It was NEVER listed in any Chevrolet literature, etc. Then, when having a car judged, is the kit a deduction? If not, why not?
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Actually it should not be considered as a genuine Chevrolet part as it is not listed in any Chevrolet material, so far it has always been accepted. This would be like the after market
Cadillac conversion for 1956 and 1957 models.
I didn't get my G&D so am looking forward to what the article says......
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Actually it should not be considered as a genuine Chevrolet part as it is not listed in any Chevrolet material WOW!!!!! So then if Kate is correct in her article, and the kit was not available until '48, then a '47 with the kit should have major points deducted?? WOW!!!! Breaking news here!!!
Russell #38868
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This is not offical but every "period" picture shows it on a 1948 only and back in my day I never saw a kit on a 1947.
Gene Schneider
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The kit was not a dealer installed option (that should read accessory).....it was an aftermarket item that was sold to dealers by a non-Chevrolet company. It was NEVER listed in any Chevrolet literature, etc. Actually it should not be considered as a genuine Chevrolet part as it is not listed in any Chevrolet material Here is some other "breaking news" as well: The VCCA judging manual states: "It is the owners’ understanding that when they decide to have their vehicles judged, we, as club members, are comparing their vehicles to how the manufacturer delivered the vehicles to the dealer and to the public." "Any feature, option, or accessory shown in the original factory or dealer catalog, sales literature, company service bulletins, or other original Chevrolet or General Motors
literature, is accepted for judging." "A mandatory 100-point deduction will be taken for the following reasons: incorrect engine, incorrect paint color, non-authentic body or body panels (25 points per panel) and after-market air conditioning." So....based on what the VCCA judging manual states, points should be deducted for the wood kit on a 1948 Chevrolet as well because the wood kit is an aftermarket item and not a genuine Chevrolet accessory.
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I hate to say it but I agree with the above.
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Ooops, there it is!  Plain as can be stated! Official, legit, but....! How come this seems to go unenforced? Dog, thank you for taking the time to answer. You should write a article about this and submit to the G&D as I think this will surprise many members. I can just see a big oh smile on Charlie's face! 
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Wnen I get my G&D and read the article I will send in my reply if incorrect or doesn't contain all the facts.
The simple thing is proper documentation.
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Gene, I hope you receive your copy today as Kate make two statement that seem to differ from yours.
One is, "The Country Club trim package was a factory-approved, dealer-installed option that would fit any 1948 Chevrolet two-door."
Two is, "The kit, designed by Chevrolet". Not sure about this one as I don't remember making a comment about this.
Come on Mail Person.
Russell #38868
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Not in todaaaaaaaaaaaas mail 
Gene Schneider
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Gene, I hope you receive your copy today as Kate make two statement that seem to differ from yours.
One is, "The Country Club trim package was a factory-approved, dealer-installed option that would fit any 1948 Chevrolet two-door."
Two is, "The kit, designed by Chevrolet". Not sure about this one as I don't remember making a comment about this.
come on Mail Person. This would be a pretty big statement if the VCCA deducted points for The kit...  Note "this accessory could be ordered only thru FACTORY AUTHORIZED DEALERS" If it was designed and authorized buy Chevrolet for Chevrolet in 1948,would this not be an original 1948 Chevrolet accessory
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No need to wait here is the article ![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss79/chefchevy/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/photo.jpg)
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Yes it would if it is in Chevrolet material....which would be the the documentation.
On the other side if it was Engineered Enterprises that came around and made the contract with dealers to give them the exclusive right to sell their product and Chevrolet was not involved (which I believe was the case) it would be a different story.
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I am in agreement with Junkyard Dog. From my understanding is that there is NO documentation stating that the wood kit is indorsed by GM, therefore consider aftermarket. As a VCCA Judge I would deduct points because it is not an authorized GM accessory.
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I judged the bodies on one of the cars featured this year in Hudson. We didn't deduct as per VCCA rules, If you're not sure, don't deduct. As a judge, I wasn't sure and didn't want to go there...
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I do not think you could consider the wood kit "Body Panels"?
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"Body panels" must be stock as they came from the factory on the vehicle, and the condition of the body panels is also considered. If there are items that are attached to the body panels and doors, such as the Engineering Enterprises wood kit for example, then that makes the body panels non-stock and points should be deducted. However, IF actual Chevrolet documentation can be found to prove that the wood kit was, in fact, a genuine Chevrolet accessory that was authorized by Chevrolet, then no points should be deducted on 1948 vehicles that have the wood kits installed. Unfortunately, until the written documentation is found in Chevrolet literature that the Engineering Enterprises wood kits were authorized by Chevrolet, and are a Chevrolet accessory, then points should definitely be deducted since, at this point, the wood kit is considered an aftermarket item.
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In this case and others there is a problem. Once something is published in the G&D and not rescinded or modified it generally becomes acceptable in VCCA Judging. So in this case there needs to be additional research to determine if in fact there is documentation to support the articles in the November issue.
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There are a few special cases where I wish our club would make a stand on accepting certain "options" for the sake of preserving Chevrolet related history. These wood panel kits, El Morocco's, and some of the factory backed and sponsored race cars are a few examples I can think of. These cars are just so rare that we should not be pushing them away from our club, or convincing owners to change them back to stock.
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If you feel strong enough then submit a motion to accept certain specified historic Chevrolet based vehicles in VCCA judging.
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The Mangy Old Mutt
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The answer seems clear. If the Engineered Enterprises wood kit has a GM PART NUMBER, it is a GM PART OR GM ACCESSORY. No GM PART NUMBER does not equal a GM PART or ACCESSORY. I have never seen a GM PART or a GM ACCESSORY, without a GM PART NUMBER If "Joe Blow" in GM Engineering or Purchasing OK'd the kit for installation on Chevrolets, that's fine for Engineered Enterprises. But "Joe Blow" doesn't distribute GM PART NUMBERS. Sounds like GM wanted to keep the wood kit as an aftermarket kit, without bringing the kit into the GM family.
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Part of the problem with outside companies producing parts for use on Chevrolets is the expressed or implied warranty. GM does not like to stand behind any product or part that they have not researched, engineered and have some control on quality. It was abundantly clear when I worked for a supplier company.
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Part of the problem with outside companies producing parts for use on Chevrolets is the expressed or implied warranty. GM does not like to stand behind any product or part that they have not researched, engineered and have some control on quality. It was abundantly clear when I worked for a supplier company. It was also crystal clear to me, as I did my 35 year sentence with the General.
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It appears to me the judging field is getting very muddy. We say one day as delivered from the factory. Then we say as delivered by the dealer. I do not think it can be both ways. The more exceptions we make the muddier it gets.
I do not have a current Judging Manual. What does it say.
I know of one 1931 Chevrolet 5P Coupe that was paint combination 70. Harvard Crimson and Black. It was painted red under the fenders with red wheels. The twin brother of the original owner told me his brother told the dealer he would buy the car if they would make these changes. This was about 1960. The twin that purchased the car new had died and the brother kept the car until he died and I would see the car around our neighborhood.
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I disagree. The process and criteria are abundantly clear if you read the VCCA Judging Manual in total.
The following is copied directly from the 2011 Edition of the VCCA Judging Manual.
"It is the owners’ understanding that when they decide to have their vehicles judged, we, as club members, are comparing their vehicles to how the manufacturer delivered the vehicles to the dealer and to the public." "A vehicle being evaluated at a VCCA-sanctioned Meet may be an original or restored vehicle, and it is evaluated by comparing its condition to when it was delivered from the factory, to the new car dealer and to the public. Any feature, option, or accessory shown in the original factory or dealer catalog, sales literature, company service bulletins, or other original Chevrolet or General Motors literature, is accepted for judging. The vehicle owner is responsible for documenting all features, options and accessories as being correct for that year and model."
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I have sent an email to the editor, President and judging "chief" pertaining to this thread. I am sure a positive decision will be made pertaining to this question and results will be forth coming.
Gene Schneider
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THANK YOU Gene!
The pictures Kate included with her article, any idea what they were take from? Maybe some "official" advertisement or....?
Just hope the Chef does not bleed-out from the dagger in his heart. Hang on Bruce, I'm thinking positive on this one!
Russell #38868
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I do not have a current Judging Manual. What does it say. The complete juding manual is on the VCCA web site.
The Mangy Old Mutt
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What about this???
vehicles to how the manufacturer delivered the vehicles to the dealer "AND TO THE PUBLIC." After the dealer adds the factory approved accessory's, ordered by the customer?
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The add posted in the G&D is a folded card with the pics of 3 body styles and the front page THE NEW CUSTOM COUNTRY CLUB. The fine print on the front page reads "portions of materials herein have been reprinted with permission of the General Motors Corporation,Sevice Operations. "License 0710896 ![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss79/chefchevy/photo.jpg) This would tend to imply GM owned some of this material??
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If that is the case it would be documented by GM/Chevrolet and would e legal. Hope that this is legit.
Looks like the problem may have been solved.
The next move will be to detect the real wood kits from the reproductions.
Still waiting for my G&D
Last edited by Chev Nut; 10/30/15 03:35 PM.
Gene Schneider
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"portions of materials herein have been reprinted with permission of the General Motors Corporation, Sevice Operations. "License 0710896 Having watched many episodes of "Perry Mason" growing up, the "License #" could have been permission to the product maker to use a Chevrolet in their advertisement. 
Russell #38868
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the "License #" could have been permission to the product maker to use a Chevrolet in their advertisement. Good point. A lot of reproduction parts and reprint literature today that are sold by aftermarket suppliers are licensed by GM but they are not items made by GM. If the wood kit was actually a genuine Chevrolet accessory I would think that the kit would have a Chevrolet part number and be listed in the 1948 Chevrolet accessory literature. Anyway, this is a very interesting subject!
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Hello chef-chevy:
Can you email me a high resolution picture of the literature which you posted here on Chevy Chat? IF Country Club kits were authorized by Chevrolet then we should include that information in the Judging Manual.
To everyone:
I also like the idea of including rare or unusual Chevrolets whether they be Chevrolet sponsored Nascar vehicles or other rare Chevrolet or GMC vehicles. I believe that we can all enjoy them if we decide on a realistic and logical way to include them on or beside the judging field at national meets. It does not mean that we have to judge them or create a special class for these vehicles nor do we need to offer them trophies. Chevrolet has been active over the years in doing things other than selling vehicles to the masses.
dtm
the toolman
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Dave
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The Mangy Old Mutt
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![[Linked Image from pic100.picturetrail.com]](http://pic100.picturetrail.com/VOL401/9967837/24663370/411808116.jpg) This, to me, would suggest that Chevrolet approved of the installation of the kit! I would like to know where Kate got the information, "The kit, designed by Chevrolet" came from.
Russell #38868
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We need to properly define the word aftermarket, as it keeps coming up...."something that is added after the purchase of something...If I were to purchase a fleetline in 1948 and wanted the CC kit on it, I would buy the car with the kit installed, not buy it and then have the kit installed...Doesn't sound like aftermarket to me...Obviously not a lot of takers....
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If that is the case it would be documented by GM/Chevrolet and would e legal. Hope that this is legit.
Looks like the problem may have been solved.
The next move will be to detect the real wood kits from the reproductions.
Still waiting for my G&D Detecting the real wood kits, from the reproductions, could be an interesting issue, if there are no GM PART NUMBERS to work from, as a "base" or "starting point". How would a judge or anyone determine an "original aftermarket wood kit", from a "replica" of an aftermarket wood kit ? Gets confusing. An interesting situation here, but am wondering how "parts" or a "kit" can be deemed "factory equipment" or "factory accessories", without a GM part number? To me, perhaps only me, but it soumds like Engineered Enterprise Company received the blessings and well wishes from Chevrolet to manufacture these kits.... then, in return, Chevrolet made profit, as the exclusive outlet to sell these Engineered Enterprise Company kits. Does selling this aftermarket kit, by GM, make it a GM part? We remember the NPN's (NO PART NUMBERS) on repair orders, meaning aftermarket parts which were supplied to the customer, by a Chevrolet dealer. NPN's were not to be confused with GM part numbers. NPN's were also used for nuts, bolts, sandpaper and the like. If a NPN wood kit can be deemed "factory equipment", will that open the door for other "aftermarket parts", to be considered "factory equipment", as well ? I was of the belief that the GM parts and accessory manuals were the base for determining what was factory and what was not factory equipment. Perhaps the wood kit will be the first item to be VCCA accepted and judged, without being in the GM parts and accessory manuals. Have to say the wood kit looks good, GM or not.
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"We need to properly define the word aftermarket, as it keeps coming up...."something that is added after the purchase of something"...
Something that is added after the purchase of something could be "factory equipment".
Aftermarket parts are a "duplication" of original factory produced parts. An example could be Moog ball joints.
Aftermarket parts are also parts, which are not produced by the factory. An example could be a "roll cage", within an interior.
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bobg, I have also been told by some that we can't use a parts book of the same year as the vehicle because they are replacement parts. If we can't use our parts book what can we use?
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Hello chef-chevy:
Can you email me a high resolution picture of the literature which you posted here on Chevy Chat? IF Country Club kits were authorized by Chevrolet then we should include that information in the Judging Manual.
I bought my "The new custom Country Club" brochure(folder) on e-bay from pjsautolit. (PJ's Auto Literature) in Reinbeck Iowa. Since there were more than one offered it would appear it is a repo (hopefully of an original) vs something made up.
Dick
dtm
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We have to be careful and do our research as completely as we can. Not all parts on these Chevrolets had part numbers listed in the parts books. They did have manufacturing part numbers but those generally were not available to either Chevrolet dealers or repair facilities. Tires, tubes, some fasteners are examples. So were the 90 deg. wear irons on Chevy pickups. Look in some of the assembly manuals to find examples. So literature available to us may not tell the complete story.
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Some limited options required contacting the factory in order to get replacement parts, etc.
Gene Schneider
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[color:#FFFF66][/color]Still waiting for my G&D [/quote] Wow, I know you live in Wisconsin but still no G&D!  Dick
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Lookng back at the pictures it is a reprint....but done with GM's permission. Also Chevrolet would not have permitted the use of the Chevrolet Bow Tie if it was not printed//published by Chevrolet in 1948.
And only Chevrolet would have used a dark green coupe with no white walls for a picture.
Now the next Question is, is it legal for a 1947?
Gene Schneider
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bobg, I have also been told by some that we can't use a parts book of the same year as the vehicle because they are replacement parts. If we can't use our parts book what can we use? That is not entirely true. A Parts book of the same year of the vehicle is what you want to use. Later parts books that were published a couple of years after the car was manufactured contain parts that cover several years of applications and replace the original part that was initially issued from the factory.
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Also Chevrolet would not have permitted the use of the Chevrolet Bow Tie if it was not printed//published by Chevrolet in 1948. I don't totally agree with the above because there were some independent companies that made accessories for a specific year that were not made by Chevrolet, nor offered by Chevrolet, but yet the accessory items had the Chevrolet bow-tie. Some of the companies were licensed by GM and some were not.
The Mangy Old Mutt
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bobg, I have also been told by some that we can't use a parts book of the same year as the vehicle because they are replacement parts. If we can't use our parts book what can we use? Boy, that's a good question. I was under the impression that the parts and accessory book was the VERIFICATION for any parts on our classic cars.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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The parts books only contain the parts offered by Chevrolet for replacement of those originally installed. Many are exactly the same as the original parts. Some are only offered as an assembly and not individual parts, seats are an example. Other parts are not offered in the part distribution system and therefore not in the books.
The parts books from the year of manufacture are in most cases the best. However some parts may not be listed until the next year. Examples are emblems and some trim parts. If there is more than one edition in a given year the later book often contains more part listings than the earlier one. That can be good or bad. If you have an early production vehicle the later book may not accurately list all the parts on your vehicle as some parts might have been changed. Low volume parts often are only listed for a short time (like upholstery). Often some parts have been upgraded or changes so relying on a later year can be risky.
The bottom line is that consulting multiple years parts books from a few years prior to production and several years after production will give the most accurate information.
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Now the next Question is, is it legal for a 1947? If one looks closely at the 3 cars pictured on the brochure (folder)they are in my opinion all 1947s. There is a gap between the top piece of wood and the belt molding. When the kit is on a 48 the top wood touches molding due to the 48 molding is wider than the 47. Also, the 1st page of the installation instructions I have says "For converting 1947-48 Chevrolet Aero Sedan to Custom Country Club Model". I would think it possible that a dealer could still have some 47 models when the 48s came out and a buyer asking for the kit to be installed on his/her new 47. Dick
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You are correct. I did not get my G&D and don't have all the pictures but in the coupe picture the window reveal moulding are of the 1947 type.
Gene Schneider
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I got mine over a week ago. Maybe someone thought they needed it more than you do. Here is a like to the internet copy. http://vcca.org/members/vccadocs/GDflip/201511/index.php
1946 Chevy 3100 1/2 Ton Pickup Purchased 11/18/17 Sold 9/20
1948 Chevy Fleetmaster Coupe, Purchased 6/20/2010
1965 Chevy ll 350 Purchased Feb 2021. 3-speed Saginaw Hurst Floor Shifter 3.08 Rear End
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Last edited by chef-chevy; 10/31/15 12:57 PM.
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OK - My G&D came today.
You had these pictures and instructions all this time?
I will say this was with Chevrolet's blessing as the bow tie was allowed in the picture.
I am sure this is enough documentation to satisfiy VCCA judging rules. DTM should comment soon.
The Fleetline in the picture appears to have a grille T bar
The Maroon Fleetline in the G&D picture is eith a 1947 with a T bar or a 1948 with a 1947 hood emblem.(top of page)
Last edited by Chev Nut; 10/31/15 01:17 PM.
Gene Schneider
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I am a bit excited but will wait until Mr Miner gives his blessing?
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As with all good fairy-tails, this one has a happy ending!!!  But... we need to know what Kate based the '47 comment on?
Russell #38868
'48 4 door Fleetline
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"Yes it would if it is in Chevrolet material....which would be the the documentation.
On the other side if it was Engineered Enterprises that came around and made the contract with dealers to give them the exclusive right to sell their product and Chevrolet was not involved (which I believe was the case) it would be a different story".
Based on your earlier comments above, are you saying you believe the kit would be considered a "factory accessory", without GM part numbers ?
If the wood kit would now be considered a "factory accessory".... but still being from an aftermarket source, that could open the flood gates for any non GM accessory, without a GM part number, which has been advertised with the GM Chevy bowtie attached to the ad.
I like the looks of the wood kit, but seems to be a risky position for VCCA judging to take, without modifying the "factory accessory criteria".
If a guy shows up with a continental kit on his car, with a bowtie ad, he's OK, as well.
In my time here, trying to muddle through the VCCA judging process, I was led to believe the GM part number was the legitimate "birth certificate" for VCCA, while judging the authenticity and correct application of same part. If VCCA judges could document the part number for that part and that specific year vehicle, all was considered to be valid.
Perhaps my thinking is all wrong, regarding legitimate parts and their numbers, in relation to VCCA judging.
Confusing now.
IF non GM parts are to be considered acceptable for VCCA judging, the judging manual will need to reflect that concern, to keep everyone on the same page, with the new changes..
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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Here is a good pic of the fliers front page verbiage ![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss79/chefchevy/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/BRUCE20SCAN.jpeg.jpg) Here is the fine print ![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss79/chefchevy/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/BRUCE20SCAN.jpeg%202.jpg) It is my thought that the sketches were the design given to the vendor so they could fab the wood kit, that being part of the reason for the disclaimer
Last edited by chef-chevy; 10/31/15 03:58 PM.
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The Mangy Old Mutt
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Is it possible Chevrolet did not want to take full responsibility of possible failure of this project...As we know ,although great looking,sales were dismal
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What is the difference in the hood emblem between a 47 & 48?
1946 Chevy 3100 1/2 Ton Pickup Purchased 11/18/17 Sold 9/20
1948 Chevy Fleetmaster Coupe, Purchased 6/20/2010
1965 Chevy ll 350 Purchased Feb 2021. 3-speed Saginaw Hurst Floor Shifter 3.08 Rear End
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The wings on the 48 are higher then the bow tie
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OK -
The Fleetline in the picture appears to have a grille T bar
The Maroon Fleetline in the G&D picture is eith a 1947 with a T bar or a 1948 with a 1947 hood emblem.(top of page) I call it a 48 due to the width of the belt molding and the top wood piece of the CC Kit looks like it touches the molding. But, the word CHEVROLET on the top bar of the grille is black and I believe it is red on a 48. So what we have here is a car that can't make up it mind what year it wants to be.  Dick
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1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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Did anyone get a response from Kate?
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She did respond to my email the other day, She is leaving up to the powers that be to decide the case. Can't blame her.
"don't shoot the messenger"
Gene Schneider
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this just might add to the confusion, I have what I would consider to be an original country club brochure that I got as an insert in a 1948 chevy sales brochure that I bought around 1963-4, the sales literature was original nos. this woody brochure is not like the ones shown on this site.I do not have a way to post any pictures of this but it does not have any reference to gm licensing permission it, but in the blank space at the bottom of the header page printed in red (not stamped)is don allen chevrolet with the address of broadway at 57 street new york new york also the curley cues at top are red as well, also there is no chevy bowtie anywhere on the piece, and the t bar is plainly visible on the conv. and the fleetline, also the wood comes right up to the chrome beltline,seeing as how I have had this for over 50 plus years I have no reason to believe this is a reprint. I also wonder that their address being in the fisher building in detroit if there might be some connection to chevrolet through fisher body.
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Can you send me the pics,I will post?
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Here's a thread from a year ago, speaks of the wood kits, as well. In this 2 page thread, there are "yeas" and "nays", regarding the authenticity of the wood kit. https://vccachat.org/ubbthreads.php/topics/317094/1
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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For guidance for the powers that need to make a descision on this topic I think we should have a vote at some point. I sure would not want to be the person saying yes or no to the owners of these distinctive cars. By the end of this week there should be enough new information to go ahead and do so. After this is settled the ElMorroco should be next. 
Gene Schneider
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Gene,
I respectfully disagree with a vote by Chat members by the end of the week. It is a technical not a popularity issue. The VCCA Judging Committee is charged by the Board to review, research and then decide on judging issues. They should review the available literature references and then decide if it is keeping with the purpose and values of the VCCA.
How Sweet the roar of a Chevy four!
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Let me weigh in here...Yes I am a bit bias on this topic, in my right mind I never considered the Country Club Trim Kit for my 48 Fleetline was any less then a Chevrolet sponsored product and hens correct for my car...After first seeing the kit many years back and reading it was factory approved, I had to have it! I Searched high and low and 2 years later, my friend Ida found a NOS kit in Detroit,still in the box...When I got the kit, the box was in poor shape, there was no print on it, but wood was in great shape, the transfer flim and instructions were also in fairly good shape...You have to guess, I was pretty excitedî...After Mayland Black paint, it was time to suck it up ,drill a bunch of holes and install...It was easier than I expected and I was a happy camper...The Fleetline has been enjoyed by many, being awarded 2 gold awards, first senior oval and best of show at a regional VCCA meet...As most of you know "except for my Fulton" I am extremely into things being accurate and correct...I will say I would be shocked if the CC Wood Kit is deemed not so Let's face the facts "although not all documented" I have read 3 different magazine articles "one being the G&D the CC Kit was factory approved There is a Bow Tie a brochure advertising the CC Kit for Chevrolets only VCCA Judging has accepted CC Kit as correct to date And what about Chevrolets sales and marketing business common sense in the late 40's Would any auto company allow such a large appearance change of one of their new vehicles leave a dealership with out some type of ownership in this venture????? ![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss79/chefchevy/48%20Chevy%20Pics/002.jpg) SAVE ME,I am 100% Chevrolet
Last edited by chef-chevy; 11/01/15 05:20 PM.
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"For documentation you need material from Chevrolet.Just sold through Chevrolet Dealers doesn't mean it was a Genuine Chevrolet part or accessory.
There is a long list of things the dealers sold, especially in the 1946-1948 years when Chevrolets were in short supply and the dealers loaded them up with a lot of accessories."
Referring to the wood kit in last years thread, the above quote was written in that thread. The comments make sense to me, but what makes sense to me may not mean anything to the next guy. Valid accessory or not, I like the "rich appearance", that the wood kit provides.
40 years ago, when my son played "Tee League Baseball" and "Midget League Football", the CHAMPS received the trophy, and ONLY THE CHAMPS.
In todays world, kids receive trophies for showing up, each one receives a trophy, from the water boy to the star player.
Is that where VCCA is headed ?
In last years thread, Chipper noted an owner, whose car was not Powerglide equipped, from the factory (as I understood), but was granted a "no deduction", since it was now Powerglide equipped, due to the owners personal physical issues. Now, the next step, the owner wanted "a free pass" for air conditioning, as well.
This idea of "individual variances" is a mess. Has nothing to do with how the new vehicle was delivered, to the owner.
VCCA has some sort of a plan to determine the authenticity and validity of anything that is on the vehicle being judged. Correct ?
If so, the same "plan" should apply, for each part, each kit, or whatever.
I'm now reading the validity of the kit does not depend on a GM part number, but, instead, it is suggested that the validity and authenticity should be determined if there is a "CHEVY BOWTIE", within the ad, from days gone by.
Does the VCCA judging rule state the "CHEVY BOWTIE" should / must appear in ads, to validate authentic accessories or parts ?
Perhaps its time to hand out awards to each entry, just like the trophy handouts in todays Tee League Baseball.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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One thing I have noticed with the cars with the wood kit is that each one is a different color of wood. Which one is correct? Some took more red and others more brown.
See you Touring the Back Roads
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Just to be clear, a part of me hopes that the wood kit is authenticated for the three '48 Chevrolet models. They really look sharp. Another part understands that any non-official Chevrolet accessory that is allowed to to get a point deduction pass takes a tiny piece out of the purpose for the VCCA and penalizes the guy that "does it by the book".
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I understand...What are your. Thoughts about this kit being added by the dealers with out full buy off by the Chevrolet executives...Pretty bold move in the 40's
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Pretty bold move in the 40's Not really. There were other parts made in the aftermarket industry prior to the late 1940's that used the Chevrolet bow-tie under license and they were not genuine Chevrolet accessories. The accessories were not listed in the parts books nor did the accessories have a Chevrolet part number. These items were available both from the Chevrolet dealers and from aftermarket suppliers. Also, there were generic aftermarket accessories that were sold and installed by the Chevrolet dealers back in the early 1930's as well. Question: Does anyone know if Engineered Enterprises also sold their Chevrolet wood kits direct to the consumer, especially since their name appears on the flyer? If they did, then that would possibly indicate that their product was not a genuine Chevrolet accessory.
The Mangy Old Mutt
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I'm sure they did not cover a 1/3 of the car?
Last edited by chef-chevy; 11/01/15 10:44 PM.
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I'm sure they did not show on a 1/3 of the car? ???? Can you be more specific as to what you mean?
The Mangy Old Mutt
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The look and design of the car is changed in a big way!
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The Mangy Old Mutt
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In last years thread, Chipper noted an owner, whose car was not Powerglide equipped, from the factory (as I understood), but was granted a "no deduction", since it was now Powerglide equipped, due to the owners personal physical issues. Now, the next step, the owner wanted "a free pass" for air conditioning, as well.
I know personally of a case where the national BOD issued a variance to a VCCA member who had major physical handicaps in about 1997?. Walking was a significant challange for this VCCA member. He wanted to stay active in driving his old Chevrolet. This guy could not use his feet to operate the clutch. This VCCA member was granted a variance and was allowed to put an automatic in his late 1940's (?) vehicle, that was originally only available with a stick shift. This VCCA member was not granted a variance for installing A/C. FYI. I was Chief Judge at the Meet where his vehicle was judged.
I have not know of the National Board ever doing this again since this particular case in the late 1990s.
If anyone would like to talk about the issue of a variance, I suggest that you start a new thread. This thread on the Country Club Kit has been fantastic so far.
dtm
the toolman
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Dave
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VCCA #83 1940 Chevrolet Technical Advisor
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Dave,
It is great having the discussion on the CC wood trim in a public forum. The more relevant inputs particularly concerning literature references the better. However I believe the discussions on VCCA judging criteria and possible exemptions or special accommodations should be in another thread in one or more of the members forums.
How Sweet the roar of a Chevy four!
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Can you send me the pics,I will post? Won't dlt need your e-mail unless he uses private msg to you ??? Love to see what he has. Dick
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Dick I tried him again and gave him my e-mail as well
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Yea, I've checked several times today to see it was posted. Slow day today.
Russell #38868
'48 4 door Fleetline
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Not a lot of luck with this one...dlz,must be new here..He must not be checking in or answering my PM...His profile has no e-mail
Last edited by chef-chevy; 11/03/15 09:42 AM.
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In the Country Club thread from August of 2014, Mr Scott, from the VCCA Judging Committee, stated a precedent was already established for the Country Club package.
If that statement is accurate, this years discussion of the same C.C. kit appears redundant.
Genuine GM or not, kit looks good and VCCA judging has already accepted the kit.
"Guys, we have already set a precedent with the Country Club package. We have three of them in the system already. I think we are going to have to be open to some of the examples that you all have given. Woody wagons, SRC conversions into convertibles, hearses, ambulances, fire trucks, ice cream trucks, yes, even Yenkos, in my humble opinion. A few years back we presented a motion to the BOD to have a "Special Interest" class. It was set up similar to HPOCF and CDPC. It included most of what we are talking about. Other examples were airport limos, speedsters and a whole lot more. The motion fell on deaf ears.
It has been long over due but the Judging Program needs some attention. Perhaps an assessment of some kind. It would be nice to have a revised and fresh program ready for 2016. ??
_________________________
Steve Scott- VCCA Judging Committee
1956 Bel Air 4 dr.Sedan
1985 Type 10 Cavalier Conv.
1986 Cavalier RS Conv.
www.vcca.org/~nir/ "
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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Just because there are three CCs in the system does not mean that they have been officially accepted without possible point deduction. I say that because it is likely that the judges for those particular car(s) may not have been comfortable deducting points for the added trim. The policy is not to deduct unless the judge is relatively certain. A judge at the next meet may feel that the CC kit is aftermarket and deduct points.
How Sweet the roar of a Chevy four!
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I think it is pretty much been decided here that the wood kit is incorrect! But incorrect what,body panel or accessory?
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I think they look really good and should be accepted as a period correct accessory. But I think most period correct accessories should be accepted. I'm not talking hotrods but stuff that dealers sold should be OK. JMHO 
Ed
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"Guys, we have already set a precedent with the Country Club package."
What was the precedent that was established?
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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The Mangy Old Mutt
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I have to admit the wood kit does look attractive. I very much wanted a wood kit on my Aerosedan but after researching it out I opted not to pursue it due to the fact it was not a GM approved option. As a VCCA lead judge for the San Fernando Valley chapter for the last 10~15 years I have not judged a Aerosedan with a wood kit. I would absolutely hate to deduct points because of it. It was stated that points were not deducted on a car with a wood kit and that is understandable, WHY? Because if a judge is not absolutely sure if something is incorrect it is advised not to deduct. BUT! If a judge is knowledgeable and the owner cannot show proof or documentation then points are to be deducted. I would very much want to be proven wrong and have some proof come to light that the wood kit is GENUINE CHEVROLET APPROVED ACCESSORY, but I have not been convinced otherwise. In fact I have consulted a few guys I know with tons of literature and documentation and there is nothing to support that the wood kit is GM approved. Since it is NOT GM approved accessory it is a body panel deduction. I am going to consult my chief judge who happens to be extremely knowledgeable with judging since we are having a VCCA sanctioned car show this weekend. I will be judging again and will need to know what to do if a car shows up with a wood kit, because I would instinctively deduct points.
I for one hate to deduct points on cars that have been beautifully restored. I know what it takes to restore a car, the time, money, and effort. It pains me to see a Fleetmaster with flawless full woodgrained dash and have to deduct because the dash should not be fully woodgrained. Cars with aftermarket/reproduction gravel guards are very common but not correct, hence deduction. I see it all the time where someone does something a certain way because they thought it was correct from what they saw in another person’s car.
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I have not had the experience of having my 1951 Chevys judged, so here are my comments/questions, in an effort to understand.
It "sounds" to me, that the judging of a vehicle is based on the combined knowledge of the judges, in attendance, on any particular "judging day". At one event, no deductions, at another event .... deductions, for the same item. Confusing to me.
I have read the C.C. kit and visor thread from August of 2014.
I have read Mr Scott's remarks, within that thread, stating the C.C. kit has established a precedent. What does that indicate ?
I read your above comments, as well.
If there is no GM part number or no GM accessory number, doesn't that alone end any confusion, as to the validity or not, of a part or accessory?
I may be missing a piece of the puzzle here, but I'm trying to gain clarity, as to the VCCA format, regarding judging.
I was of the belief that a GM part number was the green light for authenticity, within judging ... while any part without a number was not GM.
Any clarification is appreciated.
Thanks.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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Here is part of the post from Steve in 2014
.***** GM had a contract with the company to offer the Country Club package****. The name of the company slips my mind right now. It would be similar to SRC making the convertibles in the early 80s. We have had Country Clubs judged before and there would be no deduction for that.
_________________________
Steve Scott- VCCA Judging Committee
1956 Bel Air 4 dr.Sedan
1985 Type 10 Cavalier Conv.
1986 Cavalier RS Conv.
www.vcca.org/~ni
What do you think???
Last edited by chef-chevy; 11/04/15 05:44 PM.
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Since I am an owner of a CC Package car I most likely am bias in my opinion. IF it is deemed the kit is no a genuine Chevrolet accessory and points are to be deducted in the Body Panel category, will the points be the mandatory (20)? per panel or something less than that? I always assumed that was put in for those who used fiberglass fenders, etc in place of the original metal.
On a car with the CC Kit the wood was installed on top of the original metal panels. They are still there! If points are to be deducted why can't it be simply for the use of a non Chev accessory which usually is something less. If someon decides to install fleetline strips on their Fleetmaster are the body panels wrong of just what was attached to them?
I think the mandatory 20? points per panel is overkill. Certainly would discourage someone like Chef Chev from bringing his car to a VCCA Meet.
Dick
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I have not had the experience of having my 1951 Chevys judged, so here are my comments/questions, in an effort to understand.
It "sounds" to me, that the judging of a vehicle is based on the combined knowledge of the judges, in attendance, on any particular "judging day". At one event, no deductions, at another event .... deductions, for the same item. Confusing to me.
Any clarification is appreciated.
Thanks.
I think you can find that situation at any show. One judge may feel a certain item is flawed somewhat and takes a 5 point deduction. Another show and the same flaw noticed by a different judge and he/she may feel it is only a 2 or 3 point deduction. As long as each judge uses the same criteria throughout the cars he/she is judging that day it usually is not an issue. The judges have a tough job and I commend them for doing it.
Dick
Dick
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.***** GM had a contract with the company to offer the Country Club package****. The name of the company slips my mind right now. It would be similar to SRC making the convertibles in the early 80s. We have had Country Clubs judged before and there would be no deduction for that.
Steve Scott- VCCA Judging Committee
1956 Bel Air 4 dr.Sedan
1985 Type 10 Cavalier Conv.
1986 Cavalier RS Conv.
www.vcca.org/~ni
It appears this is VCCA documentation to me
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Here is part of the post from Steve in 2014
.***** GM had a contract with the company to offer the Country Club package****. The name of the company slips my mind right now. It would be similar to SRC making the convertibles in the early 80s. We have had Country Clubs judged before and there would be no deduction for that.
_________________________
Steve Scott- VCCA Judging Committee
1956 Bel Air 4 dr.Sedan
1985 Type 10 Cavalier Conv.
1986 Cavalier RS Conv.
www.vcca.org/~ni
What do you think??? OPINIONS below are from 2 different judges .... but doesn't the head of judging, or some one within VCCA determine which is correct? I thought the existence of a GM part number verified the part, as being a valid GM item. If not a criteria, maybe it should be the criteria. Mr Scott states ... "We have had Country Clubs judged before and there would be no deduction for that."Mr Johnson states ... "Since it is NOT GM approved accessory it is a body panel deduction."
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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A valid GM part number only signifies that the part was available from the GM parts system. Dealers and some repair shops could order directly from GM. There is no guarantee that any part in that system is identical to a part that was installed on the assembly line. In most cases they are but not always. I agree the part number also implies that GM authorizes those parts as replacements whether they were manufactured by GM, an qualified original supplier or another supplier.
Also be aware there are parts on vehicles assembled by GM factories that DO NOT have GM parts system numbers. They do have manufacturing part numbers but are not available through the replacement part system.
How Sweet the roar of a Chevy four!
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I spoke with my chief judge and explained the situation we are having. I mentioned to him about Steve Scott’s comment about judging cars with the wood kit and no deductions were taken off. My chief judge advised me to follow suit, but put in the comment that there is no evidence that the wood kit is a GM approved accessory on the judging card. I will reluctantly follow the VCCA unofficial ruling on this matter!
Now I’m not thee expert, nor the final word on 47 and 48 Chevrolets, but consider the following. There still is NO proof of the wood kit being an approved GM Chevrolet accessory. Everything I see on this post to support the wood kit is circumstantial evidence. Steve Scott’s states “GM had a contract with the company to offer the Country Club package” but where is the evidence to that? I would love to see it! Also the wood kit is no small part addition, wouldn’t you think something as big as this would have a part number?
Last edited by conv48; 11/05/15 04:34 PM.
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I agree with the above 100%. In other words leave well enough alone unless documentation is found to prove different story.
Gene Schneider
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[b]"Also the wood kit is no small part addition, wouldn’t you think something as big as this would have a part number?"[/b]
Yes, I agree with your logic, but I also have ZERO experience with the judging procedures, thus trying to learn what the criteria is for giving point deductions or not.
From all I have read here, I see various opinions, but believe base rules must take precedence over opinions.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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"Also be aware there are parts on vehicles assembled by GM factories that DO NOT have GM parts system numbers. They do have manufacturing part numbers but are not available through the replacement part system."
How would replacement parts be procured, when needed, if these parts do not have part numbers ?
Are you possibly speaking of nuts, bolts, tires, tubes and the like?
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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One example of a part that was used on 40+ years of Chevrolet trucks is the 90 deg. wear iron. Some years riveted to the box side others welded. In the early 70s it was only available welded to the bed side not as a separate part. There fore it did not have a GM part number. I was able through a VCCA member obtain the manufacturing part number. A number were ordered through a Chevrolet dealer. Later the company that manufactured the parts for Chevrolet was identified and the irons were available directly from the manufacturer.
There are a number of other similar situations. Many parts that are only available as an assembly not individual parts, batteries, tires, valve stems, upholstery material are other examples.
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As an example Chevrolet offered different high out-put generators as options for large trucks. They were listed in the option list but not mentioned in a part book. You got the parts from the supplier or a parts house that carried them.
VCCA judging is not perfect and never will be With over 100 years of Chevrolet models and hundreds of different series finding 30 judges to judge the show field in two hours is not easy.
Gene Schneider
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1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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"VCCA judging is not perfect and never will be With over 100 years of Chevrolet models and hundreds of different series finding 30 judges to judge the show field in two hours is not easy."
Understood.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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As an example Chevrolet offered different high out-put generators as options for large trucks. They were listed in the option list but not mentioned in a part book. You got the parts from the supplier or a parts house that carried them. But wouldn't there be a different Delco voltage regulator listed for that application?
John
1954 Belair Sport Coupe
1960 2 door Impala Hardtop 348/340HP 4spd
1962 2 door Impala Hardtop 409/409 4spd
1962 2 Door Biscayne Sedan 327/250 Auto
1977 Monza Mirage 305 4 Speed
1988 Celebrity Wagon
2018 GMC Sierra 2500 HD Diesel
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Guys, we have already set a precedent with the Country Club package. We have three of them in the system already. The fact that three cars were judged with the Country Club wood kit does not set a precedent. All that proves is that the judges were not sure if the wood kit was correct or not so points were not deducted for the wood kit. The "precedent" here is that, according to the judging manual, if the judges are not sure about an item then no points should be deducted. The only way that a "precedent" can actually be established is through factual documentation that the wood kit is a correct Chevrolet accessory.
The Mangy Old Mutt
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The fact that three cars were judged with the Country Club wood kit does not set a precedent. All that proves is that the judges were not sure if the wood kit was correct or not so points were not deducted for the wood kit. The "precedent" here is that, according to the judging manual, if the judges are not sure about an item then no points should be deducted.
The only way that a "precedent" can actually be established is through factual documentation that the wood kit is a correct Chevrolet accessory. I am 1000 percent in agreement with this quote!!!! I will not be convinced otherwise until I see solid evidence of documentation proving otherwise.
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How about someone write a ONE paragraph article for the G&D about the CC Kit? The title could be:
? Original Accessory or Aftermarket ?
The article would have one picture of a Country Club Wood Kit installed on a Chevy. The paragraph would ask for solid Chevrolet information either proving it as an accessory or an aftermarket add-on. We would have up to 8,000 members potentially helping us find a solution to this question. Certainly there is at least ONE VCCA member who worked in a dealership in the late 1940's and is familiar with this kit or maybe someone who might have original Chevrolet documentation.
Maybe we should call the GM Heritage Center and ask for documentation?
dtm
the toolman
60th Anniversary Meet Chairperson
Dave
VCCA # L 28873
VCCA #83 Tool Technical Advisor for 1914-1966
VCCA #83 1940 Chevrolet Technical Advisor
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Certainly there is at least ONE VCCA member who worked in a dealership in the late 1940's and is familiar with this kit Well.... considering that person is at least 80+++ years young, maybe, one left. Maybe we should call the GM Heritage Center and ask for documentation? At this point.... seems the logical next step.
Russell #38868
'48 4 door Fleetline
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The book by John D. Robertson " A Pictorial History of Chevrolet 1940-1954" features a 48 with a CC wood kit installed. Page 136. The cover on the book states " As told through original FACTORY photos from the GM Media Archives. It does state that the kits were produced by an outside company and sold thru Chevrolet dealers. It would seem strange that the factory would document and archive something if they did not approve it. I also think that dealers would be hesitant to install such a major item if it was not factory approved. Does anyone know if independent shops also installed the kits??
Last edited by m006840; 11/06/15 07:15 PM.
Steve D
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Seeings how I have pretty much given up this debate................. Here's some interesting reading...................... In the late 40'sAftermarket wood kits, designed to be applied by the owner, made their appearance during these years. These "woody-izing" kits could be screwed to the sides of non-woody vehicles and came from New York's Belbod Company as well as Engineered Enterprises of Detroit via Chevrolet's Fisher Body divisionIn Post War 1948 a Company called "Engineered Enterprises Inc. Michigan" introduced a Chevrolet solution for competitors like Ford Sportsman and Chrysler Town and Country: The idea was to produce a Modest car for a Man of Means a Woody for the Man who had lived through the Great Depression and was now Wealthy but was still conservative in nature. The Country Club was born, marking those belonging to a "Country Club set" on the Companies brochure a Blue Car was used. Within 12 months the company had gone bankrupt making this extremely rare (Blue was rarest), ironically Fords Convertible Sportsman disappeared along with the Chrysler Town and Country.
Last edited by chef-chevy; 11/06/15 08:32 PM.
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Seeing I was the first person to "doubt" the C.C. kit in this thread I would be glad to do a short "questioning" article. I had mentioned this to Kate way back at the beginning. She is understanding of the problem and even suggested it.
Gene Schneider
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Dave,
As the Chairman of the VCCA Judging Committee, I suggest you write the article. Why? Because it will eventually be the Judging Committee that makes the decision to recommend an action or no action to the Board of Directors. That is also the Committee that authors the wording in the Judging Manual. The input from the VCCA membership can be checked by the Committee with consolation with Technical Advisers and other knowledgeable people and sources.
How Sweet the roar of a Chevy four!
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The book by John D. Robertson " A Pictorial History of Chevrolet 1940-1954" features a 48 with a CC wood kit installed. Page 136. The cover on the book states " As told through original FACTORY photos from the GM Media Archives. It does state that the kits were produced by an outside company and sold thru Chevrolet dealers. It would seem strange that the factory would document and archive something if they did not approve it. I also think that dealers would be hesitant to install such a major item if it was not factory approved. Does anyone know if independent shops also installed the kits?? In the book “by John D. Robertson” the picture of the Coupe with a wood kit is just a rendering and not an actual picture of a car. I am forming a conclusion/theory that since the wood kit was offered in 1948 only that the wood kit was being considered by GM but didn’t materialize. Consider the following: One, being a drastic model change coming up in 1949. Note that in 1949 the wagon model did not use wood, rather metal panels with wood finish. Two, all other GM makes (Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Buick and Cadillac) were moving away from wood all together on the bodies.
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Actually the 1949 wagon was available in wood or steel. The wood was discontinued for 1950.
DTM...If you want to do the article it is OK with me.
Gene Schneider
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It would seem strange that the factory would document and archive something if they did not approve it. I also think that dealers would be hesitant to install such a major item if it was not factory approved. That is not really true. There are factory photos of Chevrolets with aftermarket accessories installed....among which are double sided white wall tires, aftermarket accessory trunks and etc. There are also factory photos showing displays at the Chevrolet dealership with aftermarket accessories for sale. If there was a profit to be made on an accessory the Chevrolet dealer would not only sell the aftermarket accessory but install it at extra cost as well. My all original 1932 Chevrolet barn survivor is a prime example. I am second owner of the car and when the original owner purchased the car from our local Chevrolet dealer back in 1932 (at the time it was Pierce-Allen Chevrolet in Medford, Oregon) he had the Chevrolet dealer install an aftermarket Kari-Keen accessory trunk unit on the car (at extra cost) before he took delivery of his brand new 1932 Chevrolet.
The Mangy Old Mutt
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How about someone write a ONE paragraph article for the G&D about the CC Kit? The title could be:
? Original Accessory or Aftermarket ?
The article would have one picture of a Country Club Wood Kit installed on a Chevy. The paragraph would ask for solid Chevrolet information either proving it as an accessory or an aftermarket add-on. We would have up to 8,000 members potentially helping us find a solution to this question. Certainly there is at least ONE VCCA member who worked in a dealership in the late 1940's and is familiar with this kit or maybe someone who might have original Chevrolet documentation.
Maybe we should call the GM Heritage Center and ask for documentation?
dtm
factory or dealer catalog, sales literature, company service
bulletins, or other original Chevrolet or General Motors
literature, is accepted for judging."If this paragraph is the RULE of VCCA judging, the C.C, kit is not a factory kit. Why involved 8,000 members, with 8,000 opinions, if the rule is clearly stated in the above paragraph?
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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Seeings how I have pretty much given up this debate................. Here's some interesting reading...................... In the late 40'sAftermarket wood kits, designed to be applied by the owner, made their appearance during these years. These "woody-izing" kits could be screwed to the sides of non-woody vehicles and came from New York's Belbod Company as well as Engineered Enterprises of Detroit via Chevrolet's Fisher Body divisionIn Post War 1948 a Company called "Engineered Enterprises Inc. Michigan" introduced a Chevrolet solution for competitors like Ford Sportsman and Chrysler Town and Country: The idea was to produce a Modest car for a Man of Means a Woody for the Man who had lived through the Great Depression and was now Wealthy but was still conservative in nature. The Country Club was born, marking those belonging to a "Country Club set" on the Companies brochure a Blue Car was used. Within 12 months the company had gone bankrupt making this extremely rare (Blue was rarest), ironically Fords Convertible Sportsman disappeared along with the Chrysler Town and Country. Who wrote this ?
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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They are both historical foot notes....One from hemming's and the other from woody magazine.....As you can see there are many, many opinions on this topic out there, some in print and others verbal...To date these appear to be only opinions!!!Many say GM was involved and some say not.....Remember this thread started with the statements made in OUR OWN G&D MAGAZINE........
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Never, never believe magazine or book articles. They are more often than not very inaccurate.
Also one article appears and the next one follows suit and copies it and all of a sudden it is taken as gospel.
Last edited by Chev Nut; 11/07/15 10:26 AM.
Gene Schneider
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Chevrolet didn't worry abot selling cars in 1948. Inspite of being still a post war design and the new 1949
Ford was already introduced in June of 1948 there was still a high demand for the 1948 Chevrolet. INfact a year later a used 1948 Chevroleet Fleetline sold for more than a used 1949 Ford.
The cars like the Ford Sportsman and Chrysler Town & Country were very limited production models and never profitable.
The Heritage Center is of no help other than what is available on their site.....and has also despensed some inaccurate information.
Gene Schneider
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The Mangy Old Mutt
"If It's Not Junk.....It's Not Treasure!"
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So, since it is now 66 years after the fact and no hard proof exist either for or against, the official ruling is, the club will simply ignore it. For '48 only, or '47 and '48.
Russell #38868
'48 4 door Fleetline
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The Heritage Center is of no help other than what is available on their site.....and has also dispensed some inaccurate information. So Gene what inaccurate information did they dispense????
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As I stated in my 10/31 post on this subject I think it would be entirely possible that a dealer could have one of more 47s on hand when the 48s were introduced in Feb 48 (I believe that was the month) so it could be possible to have CC kit installed on some 47s.
I mistakenly omitted stating that the brochures advertising the CC Kit show the kit installed on 47 model vehicles so it certainly would appear the maker of the kit meant it to be sold to 47 & 48 Chevrolet buyers.
Last edited by XLVIIdriver; 11/07/15 09:28 PM.
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Dick,where did you get that date of inception? BTW when you search,country club wood package,you run into an article about you and your car...Great stuff " Congrats
Last edited by chef-chevy; 11/07/15 09:42 PM.
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I was referring to the month the 48 model cars were introduced. I'm pretty sure that is correct. I'm sure Gene or someone else can confirm or correct.
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The 1948's were introduced in Feb...production began 1-12-48.
Gene Schneider
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The Heritage Center is of no help other than what is available on their site.....and has also dispensed some inaccurate information. So Gene what inaccurate information did they dispense????
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Being that there was six pages of discussion, regarding the Country Club Kit, will VCCA Judging look into this issue, to determine if the kit will be permitted, as a GM accessory, or not ?
Curious as to the next step, if there is a next step, or not.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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The "next step" has been taken. Will be in a forthcoming G&D.
Gene Schneider
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The "next step" has been taken Hum mm, Forward I hope?
Russell #38868
'48 4 door Fleetline
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That is our intention. Our meaning more than one person.
Gene Schneider
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The "next step" has been taken. Will be in a forthcoming G&D. OK, will look forward to the info provided in the G&D.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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I just know that all you out there in Chevrolet land are waiting with bated breath for me to weigh in on this CC thread. Well, maybe not. I don't which side of the issue is correct. I do know that those 47/48 year models I've seen pictures of are just beautiful. Yes, real eye poppers. The wood added to the sides of those coupes and aerosedans make them look as well as those Chrysler cars of the same era with their wood sides. I have never seen a 47/48 with the wood added but i would expect it to look just a well as a picture of one. I think the CC kit would look good on a 42 and 46, also. I think the argument about whether those with the wood should be judged without penalty is up to interpretation of the current rules. Best I can tell there is that they would suffer a severe penalty. Would I install a CC kit on my project car or the my 41 coupe, I doubt it. But I admit that such a kit may make it look better. Remember all you who are so sure of precedent that past practice can be considered precedent if suffered long enough. That is to say if judges keep on accepting the CC clad 47/48s then the owners may have a good argument that such is the norm and thus have a compelling argument that they should be judged along with those cars without the CC or with them. This CC thread has been an interesting one. I think it follows the notion that just because you want something to be right it may not actually be so. Kinda like the argument about whether Shark Teeth rims are OK for 41s no matter whether GM told the dealers to sell out all the old 40 accessories or not. I know that in spit of the Spencer Tracy picture 41 had its own wheel discs. Just my opinion about the current thread. It is my intention to not step on any toes. Charlie 
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Wow Charles...That's one of the most forgiving comments I have heard from you in years....Must be the holiday season???fleetliner or not, you have become politically correct and yeas you 41 would look great with a CC Kit
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I was of the belief that GM part numbers were the ruling force, for the judging committee.
If you could not order it from GM, it was not GM. Simple, I thought.
Perhaps, adding other criteria, such as aftermarket advertising, instead of GM part numbers, will be the "additional ruling force" for the judges.
Next year, we'll be discussing the validity of continental kits.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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You all are need to be patient on this one. It will not be quick move. 
Last edited by Chev Nut; 11/22/15 12:25 PM.
Gene Schneider
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You all are need to be patient on this one. It will not be quick move. OK, but now we weigh patience against current life expectancy.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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I just read the February 2016 issue of the G & D.
I was under the impression that a resolution was going to be announced, regarding the Country Club wood trim, but no resolution was stated.
The search for documentation continues.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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A request was sent in for the publication of a request for our membership to provide proof that the Country Club Lit was a REAL accessory authorized by Chevrolet or not.
Our Editor plans the G&D 2-4 months in advance. We have been placing moer and more 55th Anniversary Meet info in the G&D. Therefore, not enough space was available for February. Stay tuned, Kate has not forgot about this issue.
dtm
the toolman
60th Anniversary Meet Chairperson
Dave
VCCA # L 28873
VCCA #83 Tool Technical Advisor for 1914-1966
VCCA #83 1940 Chevrolet Technical Advisor
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A request was sent in for the publication of a request for our membership to provide proof that the Country Club Lit was a REAL accessory authorized by Chevrolet or not.
Our Editor plans the G&D 2-4 months in advance. We have been placing moer and more 55th Anniversary Meet info in the G&D. Therefore, not enough space was available for February. Stay tuned, Kate has not forgot about this issue.
dtm The Dan O"Day article is a gem, road testing the same roads we will take to the various points of interest in Tahoe.
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Ol' Dan is going to prove the "If you've got 'em, drive 'em" theory, running that many miles in the mountains with an H-4 Royal Mail!! Way to go Dan... I'll try and keep up!
Those accustomed to the finest...find it in Chevrolet.
1953 Belair Convertible
1951 2dr Deluxe Sedan
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Mark it down. I made a mistake. The article on the Country Club Controversy is in the February issue of the G&D on Page #33. Thanks to all of you on Chevy Chat for asking questions about this possible accessory in 1947-1948. Also a big thank you goes to chevgene on writing a superb article.
Let's see if anyone in the VCCA can solve the mystery.
dtm
the toolman
60th Anniversary Meet Chairperson
Dave
VCCA # L 28873
VCCA #83 Tool Technical Advisor for 1914-1966
VCCA #83 1940 Chevrolet Technical Advisor
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I wish I could add some insight to this topic, but I've never come across any literature/Chevrolet Service News/Chevrolet Technical Service Bulletins/Body by Fisher Service News/etc that discusses the Country Club kit.
Dale Carter
VCCA #8661
1948 Fleetmaster Convertible
1948 RHD Stylemaster Sedan Delivery
1948 1-Ton Tow Truck
1967 Camaro Coupe
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Dale, I don't know if there is supportable evidence that the kit was an authorized option or not but read on: The kits look so good that I wonder why someone doesn't tool the kit and produce it in rosewood, cedar or some other beautiful wood. It looks really good on a Fleetline that it makes me slobber whenever I see a picture of one. Beautiful wood stirs the heart and brings joy to the eyes. Just think, if you had a kit you could slap it on that old style master and make it look almost as precious and cute as as CCs ride. You wouldn't have the horizontal stripes along the lower sides but it would look much better. Don't you think.  Get yourself some pine slabs and paste them to your car. It could then be a rat-rod woodie. Just kidding. Please don't do that. You folks in SC forget I suggested that also.  Best, Charlie
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Mark it down. I made a mistake. The article on the Country Club Controversy is in the February issue of the G&D on Page #33. Thanks to all of you on Chevy Chat for asking questions about this possible accessory in 1947-1948. Also a big thank you goes to chevgene on writing a superb article.
Let's see if anyone in the VCCA can solve the mystery.
dtm My earlier post indicated that I read the Country Club article in the February G & D.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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I'm fairly certain they are being re-popped now. They used to be really rare, but now are quite common on eBay, as well as the California scene...
Those accustomed to the finest...find it in Chevrolet.
1953 Belair Convertible
1951 2dr Deluxe Sedan
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Mine came in the original box...No repop for me...It was found for me 20 some years ago in Detroit by the traveling parts lady Ida...When she returned to Oregon she drove it up to me here in Seattle...One great lady
So what did the article say? Do I need to begin removing screws??
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Mine came in the original box...No repop for me...It was found for me 20 some years ago in Detroit by the traveling parts lady Ida...When she returned to Oregon she drove it up to me here in Seattle...One great lady
So what did the article say? Do I need to begin removing screws?? I wouldn't chef, your car is beautiful with the wood!
Ed
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Personal message under "My Stuff" sent to dlz
Dick
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"So what did the article say? Do I need to begin removing screws??"
The Country Club article is available in the members forum, where you can read the G & D online.
Bottom line, the article by Gene states documentation is still being sought, asking VCCA members for assistance.
1951 Chevy Styleline Deluxe 2 door sedan / purchased from second owner 6-19-2000.
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Grease Monkey
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I believe the license number pertains only to GM marks AKA: trademarks. Trademarks are the logo on the printed material. Most likely allowing engineered enterprises to use the bowtie logo on the literature
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![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/photo.jpg.html)
![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/photo.jpg.html)
![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/CC%201%202.jpg.html)
![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/photo%203.jpg.html)
![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/CC%202.jpg.html)
![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/BRUCE20SCAN.jpeg.jpg.html)
![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/Country%20Club%20Wood%20Kit/BRUCE20SCAN.jpeg%202.jpg.html)
![[Linked Image from i563.photobucket.com]](http://s563.photobucket.com/user/chefchevy/media/48%20Chevy%20Pics/002.jpg.html)
