VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1937-1945 OH No!! No Lights ???

I have a 1941 Spec. Del. Coupe, fully restored w/ 12,000 miles. I’ve owned the car for about 1.5 years and it has runs like a top.

Last week I had a dead battery {first one}. I had the battery charged and put it in yesterday. Car started right up. My volt/amp. gauge was charging slightly while the car idled at about 1,000 RPM, and when I let the car idle at a normal RPM the gauge showed a very slight charge. Normal for my car.

BUT--- this morning I started the car up, pulled it out of the garage and let it ideal, then I pulled the lights on and after about 2 minutes, all the lights went out {dash lights, head lights and tail lights} Radio still worked, as did the horn.

Background: ALL electrical components are new {12,000 miles} such as Gen. Wiring. Volt Reg. etc. etc. Fan belt is tight and all the wiring looks visually correct. IE: In line, straight, even, tight, not warm or Hot, not touching each other and connected well.

So what do I look for ??

PLEASE, before you respond remember, you are dealing with an electrical neophyte here. So if your response is something like, “Use a size 6 flange, clipper trouble light amp-meter, reverse dwell connector lead and connect it to the positive side of the bypass neutral hot switch generator housing unit and relay assembly at .020 clearance while you polarize the first ground lead on the second amp. connection switch housing at the positive terminal connector flange while bypassing the originator unit.....” Thanks, but don’t.

I’m looking for the WORLDS MOST obvious method {s} of diagnosing this problem ONE ITEM AT A TIME. So I can LEARN.

4 notes.
1. I have a new Horn Bushing yet to be installed because at times, when I turn left the horn honks.

2. The previous owner installed a new Volt. Reg. {Delco} 3 years ago.

3. I've had No Other Problems with the cars electrical components.

4. I have NOT pulled or checked the fuse's yet. I will & advise asap.

YES!! I have repair books, tutorial's, service manuals and a "how to repair your Chevrolet" book, and I will delve into these asap. And I have done a search on VCCA chat site with more to come.

As always, ANY & ALL {easy to understand} advice is greatly appreciated. :)

Michael41 :confused: :confused:

Hello Mike
What happens if you switch off for a few minutes & then start & switch the lights on again?

I also think you'll find testing with a "triple light amp-meter" better, those old double ones never were much good & were soon obsolete!

did you check the fuse on the light switch

Probably the fuse on the back of the light switch. It should be a SFE 30. If you have modern seal beams, they probably draw more current than the original type...And that would stress the fuse more..

Hello Mike:
I agree with the 30 amp fuse issue. It is real easy to change and it is very easy to see if it is "blown". There will be a flat looking wire inside the glass part of the fuse. If it is "blown" there will be a visible break in the flat wire inside the glass tube. A break in the wire means that no voltage can get from one end of the fuse to the other end of the fuse. The fuse snaps into the back of the headlight switch. You will have to look like a pretzel to get the fuse out when you crawl under the dash.
As far as the horn bushing goes, if the horn blows when the steering wheel is turned, it often means that the wire which attaches to the horn bushing has had all of the insulation worn off. The horn blows when that circuit is grounded to the frame or body. Therefore, when you decide to put a new horn bushing in, always put in a new horn wire. The horn wire will come out in the engine compartment on the bottom side of the steering column just 5 or 6 inches up from the steering box. If you are putting in a replacement horn bushing ( NORS ), make sure that it is a quality built item. Many years ago I purchased an NORS from Chev's of the 40's. The bushing was made out of plastic and was a piece of junk. Luckily I found an NOS genuine GM part, which was 10 times better in quality and works well.
Email me if you have any additional questions.

Howdy guys, thanks for your input. Nope, I have NOT even checked the fuse's yet.

But Kipper, I did just what you asked this morning, I shut the car off and waited while I scratched my head. Then I restarted the car, and it started immediately but still No Lights...

I will look at the car tomorrow as I am at work now...

Thanks and PLEASE keep the information/education flowing. I may even end up understanding some of this..

Michael41

While you feeling like a pretzel check that all of the wires to the light switch are tight clean and not cooked.
A loose or dirty connection can cause this and sometimes burn the wires to make things harder to fix.
Tony

Update:

Removed the fuse behind the light switch, {30 amp. Long version} and it is BLOWN. :(

I'm ready to install a new one--- BUT BEFORE I do, should I try to determine the reason the fuse went out ? :confused:

Michael41

You have a short in the wiring or in a bulb socket.That means the positive wire for one of the units it touching bare metal.If the main harness is new its possible that it was installed incorrectly, wire insulation is chaffed off and actual wire touching metal, causing a short.I would begin by inspecting the tail lamp wires (follow wires in the trunk), parking lamp wires and head light wires.Seeing it blew the fuse when the lights were turned on it would be in one of the wires going to a light the the switch controlls.Could be difficult to find.Try nother fuse (always keep extras in the car).....with the lights "on" jiggle the wires one by one and see if it causes the fuse to blow again.
The blown fuse(or once the fuse is blown) will not affect the charging system...it would charge just as if the light switch was turned "off".
The battery going dead could be a clue but I doubt if it is related because if the battery went dead with the light switch in the off position non of the light wires would have been alive.For this problem check to see if the glove box light is going out when the door is closed as an example.
You may use several fuses before the short is found.

I'll use the fuses and try just what you said, following the wires and shaking/moving one of them at a time.

And I'll look for crimped, bare or wires that may be grounding out, touching each other or metal.

Should I run the eng. while I do this check, or keep the eng. off and just turn on the lights ?

I think I'll start at the light switch it self....

Thanks to all you guys, your a big help.
Michael41

It will be easier to find with the engine off, and usually, there isn't a need to run the engine to find the short.just have the battery fully charged.
I probably start the process by checking the bulb sockets for park, tail and license plate lights, by removeing the bulbs, cleaning the sockets with WD-40 and while there check the rear of the sockets for a bare wire, then carefully reinstall the bulbs, noticeing the way they plug in (some pins are deeper that others to orient the double element bulbs if any are present). The dimmer switch on many of the old cars is under the floor and subject to the water, debris etc, thrown up under the car, clean the terminals well and then saturate the works with WD-40.
Later if you determine the short is in the headlight circuit, you may have to detach the wires from the dimmer switch to determine if it is shorted internally.


It may also be a good idea to then turn on the parking lights, all the running lights, tail, park, license plate will be on and the headlamps will be off, that will eliminate the headlights from the circuit. Then if the fuse does blow you will look at tail, park and license plates. if the fuse does not blow it is a pretty good bet that the headlights are the culprits, now turn on the headlights and if the fuse blows the headlight circuit is the culprit, don't forget to check the dimmer switch. The power for the headlamps should go to the dimmer switch then to either the low beam bulbs or the high beam bulbs and the high beam indicator bulb , depending upon the way the dimmer swich is connected.
Good luck, just be methodical and don't panic!!!!
If the short is a loose bare wire it may be a problem to find. Just be sure to eliminate any circuit you can when hunting the short.

Are you running higher current than stock head and taillights? Fuses can degrade over time, especially if they are operated at their designed current for some time.

Try using a 30amp auto cuircut breaker and using jumper wires install instead of fuses. cuircut breaker will go in and out. While it is doing this go through your lighting system untill cuircut breaker remains on.

That is very good advice , in my estimation, woodbutcher.

ooops! Sorry ! wrong post

If the lights are the only connection after the fuse, another trick is to connect a light globe in place of the fuse. Remove all globes and switch the lights on if the globe lights there is a short in the system, start moving the wiring until the globe goes out, the short will be somewhere near.
Tony

Great ideas guys. I get it and I am actually learning a lot. Thanks so much. :)

Tomorrow is the big day so I'll be happy to let you all know what I find.

And if any one wants to, your welcome to stop by the garage and lend a hand, burgers & beer are on me....

For clarification and to answer some questions, the car, lights, wiring, bulbs, etc. etc are stock, as they wer

Mike, you might sell a few more hats while you are eating those burgers and drinking all that beer...Oscar :cool2:

Ok here's where I am...

Seems to be the Headlight switch is "bad" so if any one has one for sale or knows where I can get one, pls let me know.

I was told that 1941 -1954 had the same switch. {?} I do not have the part number but I am working on that....

The following co's do NOT sell a STOCK replacement: chev's40's, Filling Station, Obsolete Chev parts, or Truck stop.

As always thanks for any and all help.
Michael41

PS: With the VCCA site problems please feel free to contact me direct: mwelchhardball@mindspring.com

The switch was new for 1941.The part number was 1994022.After a few years the number changed to 1995041.It went only up to 1947.The 1948 no longer used a fuse.It had a circuit breaker.If Bruce Bugay dosen't have one (ChevyB) he does run and ad in every G&D.You can find his phone number there.Otherwise good old Ebay would be the next step.
Personally I doubt if its the light switch.If it were mine I would put some thing in place of the fuse that will not burn out and smoke out the short (watch for where the smoke comes from).If you do this , do it for only several seconds at a time.The wire leading to the "short" will get hot and begin to smoke.I would not attempt this with a 12 volt system.The lower voltage of the 6 V. system does not burn wires very fast....This is not for the faint at heart...and be ready to disconnect the "juice".....

The other thing to try is a 30 or 40 amp circuit breaker used for the power window circit on modern cars (40 amp prefered)...this will heat up and disconnect-cool and connect over and over and usually the wires will somke a little in the process.The breaker would be linked in -in place of the fuse.In the case of the head light switch being bad the larger feed wire from the ammeter to the switch would heat up, not the wires leading to the dimmer switch or tail lights.

Thanks Gene and all you other guys,

Hopefully this week I will. have time to analyze or "heat up" and get more of the details. And I'll let you know.

So far the lights-switch seems to be "burned" on the ceramic area where the "dimmer wire is located. But I will know more later.

Once more, as always, thanks for all your help, and information,
Michael41

When I got my 40, the headlight switch was fried. Couple problems that I found.

1) Owner had installed 12 volt bulbs into the panel and one in the tail light assembly....not a good idea.

2) Wires from the switch had fraid instulation and had touched the dash panel causing inermittent shorting.

I ended up replacing mine with NOS from Tim Tygert's Obsolete Chevy Parts in Georgia. Bought two in original Delco containers.

Works perfectly.

Tim Tygart's is a great place to shop for any old Chevy parts. And he's a good guy who will go out of his way to help you.

Michael41