VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - GENERAL Electrical - 6 volt '50 electrical... again!!

My convertible was running fine (for it) last week. Then it stalled. I pushed it halfway down the street before it fired, got it home, and it wouldn't start again. I have power from the coil to the points, then no power to the plugs. The points are clean, and gapped right. I have swapped the distributor cap with two others I have, and tried a different rotor. Also tried a different condenser. What else am I missing?? How do you tell if a condenser works?

check the points spring it could be grounding to the distributor case. Al

I'd clean the points or replace them. Don

The points are cleaned...and look good. Tried another set as well, just in case. I'll have a look at the spring. If the condenser was bad, how would the current react? Would it still send spark to the plugs?

If the condenser is bad or the outside case is not grounded then you will only get a weak spark at best.

Have you pulled the the center wire out of the distributor cap and see if you have spark coming from the coil to the cap. You could also put a vote meter on the mines side of the coil and see if the meter changes when the points open and close.(best to use an analog meter)

How is the outside of the case grounded? Is it a wire or just the fact it meets the block through the shaft? We did check the centre wire in the distributor as well.

The condenser is generally grounded by a clamp around the body and screw into the distributor. I have seen them hanging loose and that does not work.

Yes for sure pull the center wire out of the distributor, put the end 1/2" from a good ground on the engine block and open and close the points. If you don't get a "snappy" spark, short across the points with screwdriver. If you get a better spark that way, clean or replace the points. If neither gives a strong "snappy" spark, check to make sure you have power to the coil and if so replace the condenser.

Thanks for your help guys... I'll get back to it next week. Right now I'm in Dublin drinking beer! Cheers!

GOOD MAN ENJOY!

This is really getting frustrating now! I went and bought a new condenser and points. I have spark at the points, but it still won't fire. I added a ground from the distr. base to the block just in case it wasn't grounding right I swapped the cap,wires and rotor with the ones on my '51, and the '51 still runs! One thing I noticed is that the entire distributor is "turned" a quarter turn different on the '51 than the '50. The shop manual for the '51 says to start wire #1 furthest from the block, and work clockwise around the cap. It was set up this way, and works fine. For the '50 should I start furthest from the block, or in the same spot on the distributor, which is more up the left side? How do I tell? What else am I missing here?

When you write "still won't fire" what does that mean? No spark when center wire pulled from distributor cap, put 1/2" from ground and points opened and closed? Or no spark at the plugs? What happens when you short across the points with a screwdriver blade?

Have you checked to see if you might have a loose wire or bad connection that works when the engine is not turning but wiggles enough that it does not when the engine vibrates?

I guess I need to be a little more clear! I've been working on this alone for the most part,and there's some things I just do not have the experience with. Today I replaced the points, and had Jane come out and hit the starter for me to check for spark. There was spark there, but I'm not sure what a strong or weak one looks like. I also don't know what's happening after I put the cap back on. The cap and rotor worked on the '51 together, but not on the '50. If I'm getting spark at the points, it means I'm getting it from the coil in the centre wire, right? My neighbour was helping me use the check light last week, but wasn't around today... I'll have to wait for him to check some of these wires till I have him again to help.

If you can't answer our questions then it is very difficult to help you.
If you have spark at the points that is good. I means you have power to the points. But since the points are only a switch a spark only indicates that the switch is working. If you have a spark that will jump at least 1/2" when the distributor end of the center wire from the coil to the distributor is placed next to a ground (like the side of the engine block) it indicates that the coil and condenser are likely working as they should. It is the opening and closing the points (switch) that creates high enough voltage to jump a gap.

A single person can perform that test. Just take off the distributor cap, remove the center wire and hold the end next to a ground (a pair of gloves or insulated pliers are good to hold the wire) and open an close the points a few times. If the points are already open then take a screwdriver and short across the point arms. You should get a spark that will jump a 1/2" gap and make a "snap" sound. If it does not do that then let us know.

OK... that makes a lot of sense. I didn't realize the test you were describing was measuring the strength of the spark... I've got the battery on the charger overnight, and will try that out in the morning. Thanks for your help and patience... It's really my first time getting this involved in it!

OK... so I have a jumping spark to the engine block. The points were open a bit, so I got a jump there every time I went near it with the screwdriver as well. I'm assuming the coil is fine because I switched it with the one that was on the '51, and both coils work on it. When I put the cap back on, it cranks with lots of power, but it seems nothing is coming to the plug wires. I switched the cap and rotor and wires with the ones on the '51, and same thing. So I guess my question is do you think it's a timing problem? How could the timing get so far off, so fast as it seemed to run fine one day, then nothing the next? Also, would anything with the advance be an issue here?

What do you mean about getting spark to the engine block but not up to the plug wires? Have you held a plug wire near the block and cranked the engine and not gotten a spark? It doesn't make sense that you have switched everything around with your other car and it works there but not on this one. Is there up and down play in the distributor shaft? If you get spark to the center wire but not to the plug wires, it seems that the rotor is not closing with the cap contacts correctly. Have you cranked the engine with the cap off the distributor to see if the shaft/rotor turns? Can you turn the shaft by hand? It's possible that the shaft to drive gear pin sheared.

If you are getting spark to the plug wires:

You mentioned earlier that the distributor doesn't line up the same as your other car. Do you remember it having been the same previously? It is possible that the distributor clamp wasn't tight enough and it shifted either under hard acceleration or backing off. You can check this by pulling the #1 plug and bringing it up on compression and then checking to see if the rotor lines up on the #1 spark plug wire. It sounds like you have checked most everything else.

Or you could just put a timing light on it and check that way. An advance problem could put it off a little, but I think it would still be close enough to start.

A timing light... that's something I need to buy! OK... so I went and had another go at it. I first checked the amount of spark on the '51... It seems to get a better "jump" from the dist wire to the engine block. Jane was home now, so I had her crank it while I checked the wires. They are getting a low spark, but it will jump more than the plug gap. I cleaned and gapped the plugs as well, but they didn't seem too bad. Since I switched the coil already, I'm wondering if there's much more before that that I can change? I am pretty sure that the battery ground is OK, because it cranks at the proper speed. Could it be the voltage going into the coil that is low? The distributor shaft is turning, but it plays up and down about an eighth of an inch. Is this normal? The distributor has always been turned a bit compared to the '51. I can't turn it by hand. You mentioned bringing the compression up on cylinder #1. How do you tell when it's at the top?

Not sure if you can tell here, but the wire going into the distributor base is at 6o'clock on the '50, and 4o'clock on the '51.

What happens when you pour a small amount of gas into the throat of the carburetor or squirt some carburetor cleaner into the throat while someone else cranks it over? Maybe the problem is gas not ignition.

There's gas... after I try it for some time it floods over. Is it possible it's running too rich? I changed the plugs today as well... Still light on the spark...

Yes, It definitely can be too much fuel. Try removing the fuel line from the tank to the fuel pump, drain the line, dry any gas and then try to start it again. May take a while for it to fire if the cylinders already have too much gas in them.

I think the only difference between the two distributors is that one was removed and not put back in right; probably the bottom one. Seems that #1 should be at the front like on the upper one.

If you want to realign it, you can pull the distributor, stick a large screw driver into the hole and turn the oil pump till it will line up with the bottom of the distributor when it turns as you push it down with the rotor pointing straight forward and the #1 plug wire going to the front tower.

Actually, it looks like your cap is set up right, and if you line the rotor up to point at the tower #1 is in now, when you pull the distributor and align the pump so that the rotor points to the front, the wire connector will be on the side like your other one.

Or you can just leave it as is, because it doesn't have anything to do with your current problem.

The ground and/or positive battery terminal could still be part of the problem, because the starter takes all the juice it needs and may not leave enough for the ignition. How is the spark from the coil when you close the points? Any different from the other car? I forgot; did you try push starting it? Did you check to see if the rotor points at #1 terminal when the #1 cylinder comes up on compression?

1/8th inch play on the shaft may be a bit much but not so much to keep the car from starting. Did you try turning the shaft by hand? What you said above made me think you tried turning the distributor body by hand. Did you put the coil from the other car in and try it?

Going brain dead, so I'd better shut down now.

The correct position for the number one spark plug wire is at the six o'clock position on the distributor cap, and the rotor should be pointing to that same tower on the cap when your timing mark is lined up with the pointer on the flywheel. Your distributor or your spark plug wires might be 180 degrees out.

This is what is confusing me about the whole thing... I have switched the coil, and the one that was on the car is now working fine on the other car. I don't think the wires are all 180 degrees out, because the car ran set up like this fine the past 20 years. I think I'll take a look at the ground... that makes sense if it's possible that the starter is using all of the juice. When it started acting up I push started it in the driveway, and it went. The next time it took the whole driveway and halfway down the street. The last time we had to push it home! Jane hates pushing!

Get a test lead and connect one end to the + battery terminal and the other to the + on the coil. Try and start it or check for good spark. Don't leave the test lead connected to long without trying to start car / test for spark. If the car starts you should be able to take the wire of and the car should continue to run.

One thing about the distributor that confuses people is that it can be put in any position and still work as long as the vacuum advance hooks up okay and the grease cup is accessible. All you have to do is determine where #1 is and put all the cables in correct sequence. There is a correct position according to the manufacturer (as the JYD pointed out), but it doesn't HAVE to be that way to work. It is nice to have it correct, though.

Check the cables for corrosion (even up under the insulation of the positive) and replace if necessary. And make sure the connections are clean, tight and make good contact.

Jane sounds like she humors you pretty well, but I sure wouldn't push it any more than she likes to push the car...

Jane's a real sport... I think she hated pushing it that day because she had just gone for a 50k bike ride! The '51 got push started due to the heat in Flint 3 times as well, and she keeps coming home to me... I must be doing something right!

OK... here's where I am today. Frustrated!!

I took the battery ground off, cleaned it and the block where it attaches. I hope I'm not working against myself, switching too many things and getting different symptoms.

Today, when I turn the key on I get power to the left side of the coil. When I crank it I get power to the right side and to the points. It seems weak. When I stop cranking it all of a sudden gets stronger, and once almost fired as I stopped cranking. It seems to have plenty of power to the starter. Does this mean I'm not getting enough juice to the coil? Is it something that can be fixed at the regulator? I didn't try by-passing the ignition switch as suggested, I figure that if it starts, I'm no further ahead for the next start.

Check the electrical circuit from the starter switch to the coil.

Or better yet install the jumper from battery + post to + side of the coil. If you use an alligator clip you can take it off easily to stop engine. If that works then you have at least isolated the problem to between battery and coil. If that is the case the ignition switch is likely the problem.

So she is up to pushing cars for her "cool down" from biking?

Actually you are farther ahead by doing the jumper from battery positive to coil +. If it does start, you have a bad wire or switch in the ignition circuit. If it doesn't start you may have a problem in the starter causing it to draw too many amps. But if it doesn't start with a push, I doubt that it has anything to do with the starter.

I like to think of it as biking to warm up for pushing cars!

Okay, but don't have her working so hard on the other things that she doesn't feel up to doing other stuff for you..... You may end up having to make your own supper....

Ok... here's todays new list of symptoms.

I got it started! I ran a jumper to the positive on the coil. It seemed to not draw enough power to the starter now, and wouldn't start, but it sure sounded like it was trying to... a couple of good chugs! I then jump started it off of the '51, and it fired right up! Now the new symptoms... right when it stopped wanting to start, it was hesitating every time I stepped on the gas... still doing it. Is this because the wire going to the coil may be bad, or because the key switch is bad? If the key was bad would there not be more problems showing up? One thing I noticed is that the gas gauge reads 1/4 tank before I hooked up the coil lead, and 3/4 tank after! I'm up $25...I think I'll leave it hooked up!

I drove it around the block, and parked it back in the garage. It wouldn't restart! At least Jane doesn't have to push it... I may get dinner tonight!

Ok... I'm thinking of checking/replacing wire from the key to the coil. I don't have a spare key switch, so I'm hoping it's not that! Any other ideas?

If your key switch is bad, most likely you just need to open it up and clean the contacts. If one of the wires going to the switch or from it is loose,shorting or open, you can use a multimeter to check them out and replace if bad. Hmmm, I was thinking you had the Electrolock set up, but you don't, so I'm not sure about cleaning the switch contacts.

Good luck with it all! Rave about the dinner! (If you get any) Women do like for the vehicle you take them for a ride in to also get them home. A slight "breakdown" out in the woods is acceptable, but you need to be able to come up with a plausible explanation and get it running again without her having to push it.....

Well... I'm getting there. Here's the things I've eliminated... My neighbour came over and helped me for quite a while today. We ran a parallel wire to the wire from the coil to the ignition... No difference, so the wire is fine. We took out the key switch and and started it by holding wires together... Same thing, key switch is fine. All the while the car is starting when we put a jump to the coil. Next we went to the parts box and found two voltage regulators. One was a rusty piece of junk on the outside, and the other had "6 volt pos grnd" written on the box, but was brand new. We put that on, and the car fired right up and ran smooth! We had the firewall cover off to hold the wires for the key together, and when we went to put it back on there was shorting and sparks on the speedo cable. I guess that's the positive ground biting us? We took it off and put the old one back on. Do I need a new one, or is it adjustable?

Oh... and we took a volt meter and did some measuring on both cars. I'm not sure how it works, but here's some weird numbers. Both batteries put out around 6 volts with the car off. On the positive side of the coil the '51 is still at 5.8 volts, while the '50 is down to 3.9 volts So there's still a huge problem somewhere!

The coil on the 50 probably is shorted in the primary winding.

All Chevrolets are negative ground so you should use a negative ground voltage regulator. Since you switched from a negative ground voltage regulator to a positve ground regulator and back again, don't forget to re-polarize your generator.




To be safe, when working on wiring always disconnect the battery first.

Mack... I'm short on volts before the coil. Also the coil seems to work when hooked directly to the battery. We have been unhooking the battery to do all the work, for safety sake... eventually you have to hook things back up and try it though... The shorting on the speedo wire happened with the car running...

So does this sound like a voltage regulator problem? Or am I just knocking off another thing not to look at? If the generator needs repolarizing, how will the car behave? We ran it back into the garage...

If the generator needs polarizing, the amp meter will not show a charge when the car is running. However, ANYTIME the generator is removed or the voltage regulator is changed the generator needs to be re-polarized....especially if you go from negative ground to positive ground and then back again.

Positive ground didn't strike you as strange, eh? I think your regulator is probably okay, but you can check it by testing the voltage on the battery with the engine running. It should be a bit over 6 volts.

Anyway, I think you need to remove the battery cables and test them for continuity. I think you are losing some through the positive cable, but it could be the negative one as well.

Then again, you may be losing voltage between the battery cable connection and the wire going to the starter switch. Did you check the voltage at the switch? How about at the starter end of the wire going to the switch?

Did you disconnect the wire from the + side of the coil and check the voltage without it hooked up?

Battery cable to starter to switch to coil seems to be the problem area. It would seem that there is a bad wire or connection in there somewhere.

Positive ground regulator was ify because it came out of a box in Dad's barn, and I had no idea if the box was labeled correctly. Thought it may be wrong because we never had any cars with pos grounds.

I have to work the next couple days, so I'll get back to it later.

with sparking at the speedometer cable i would check the ground wire between the frame and the engine. i had this happen to me on an 84 gmc the ground strap was off and the engine grounded thru the speedometer cable and set fire to the plastic coating on the cable. what a suprise that was.

Okay... I've kind of got the car back to where it was 3 weeks ago, without having really done anything! I checked the cables, and am fairly certain it's not them. I had the battery on the charger overnight, and come up with 6.13 volts off of the posts, and the same at the starter... so the positive is Okay. Yesterday we got the car started by bypassing the switch, and starting the car with the coil wired right to the battery. I had the key right out and cleaned it up, but it was fine. After I put it all back in, and after having messed with the regulator, I am now getting a good voltage reading at the coil, but the starter is working too hard again! It still starts, but cranks slow. The car hasn't charged itself in some time now, and has had poor lighting for 10 years. I fixed the turn signals, and disconnected the head lights, but no signs of a bad ground. The lights are now working great, but that may be because the battery is freshly charged. I've always assumed it's a bad ground somewhere, but may need to look at polarizing the generator first. How do I do that? And where are the reverse lights supposed to be plugged in? They stay on when the car is off and left in reverse!

Oh... and after it ran for 15 minutes, and I took it around the block with the lights on, I got a reading of 5.91 volts at the battery... again, it's not charging...

To polarize the generator: touch a jumper lead from the battery terminal of the regulator to the generator terminal and remove immediately.

With the generator charging you should have about 7.5 volts at the battery. If you are getting some increase but not enough, there are some adjustments on the regulator to bring it up and/or the points in the regulator need to be cleaned. If there is no increase you need to troubleshoot the system to find out if it is the generator or the regulator. Go here to test charging system:

http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/electrical/4956MAE/4956MAE06.html

Go here to check your starter system: http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/electrical/4956MAE/4956MAE05.html

I'm not sure where the back up lights connect, but they should only come on when the ignition switch is on.

I had a really good day today!!! But now I have a new symptom!

I hooked the key back up, straightened out some wiring behind the dash an cleaned some contacts. I repolarized the generator... and for the first time in years I got a solid positive on the ammeter! It didn't go far right to positive, but 3/4s of the way. I'm assuming this is because I had the battery on the charger?

New symptom... I'm getting good solid spark from all cylinders but #6! I changed the wire, the plug, the cap, and the rotor but still get a light spark. I'm also getting a carbon build up on the plugs, and there's black looking soot and moisture on the garage floor at the tailpipe. Is this sign of a bad valve? It sounds like there's a miss, but I can't tell if it's from the plug not firing, or if the plug doesn't fire right because of a valve... if that's possible!

Thanks again for the help... you guys have been great with the ideas and solutions! I'm really hoping to get this thing into one tour this year, and we only have two left!

Good to hear that the original problem seems cured! Turn your lights and accessories on and see where your ammeter reads. You have weak spark holding the cable near the block? Or hooking up the plug and holding it against the block?

The soot sounds more like excess gas burning. It may just be from all the problems you've had over the past week or so with it not starting or running right. Take it out on the road and up to speed for a while; might take care of the #6 problem, too.

You could do a compression test to check the valves.

With the lights on it goes back to about neutral. I still think there's a short somewhere... I'm getting a weak spark holding the wire to the block, and touching a screwdriver to the end of the plug and the block. The other cylinders really jump... the front one is really weak. Not the wire, plug, cap, rotor. Is it possible valve, or timing? Can timing make 5 plugs fire right, and one be off? I wondered if an exhaust valve is stuck...

It may just be the contacts in the regulator need cleaned and adjusted, but if the battery is charged up and the lights on, just above center seems about right. The site I gave you has some values for volts and amps you can check for and tells you how to make adjustments if needed.

Could just be where you are touching the cable or spark plug to the block. Perhaps a bit of paint or rust not making a good ground? There is nothing I can think of that you haven't changed that would cause just one cylinder wire to spark weak. Did you clean and gap the plugs?

Take it for a drive and see how it acts when you get back.

Do you have a standard or automatic transmission?

If you don't have one, invest in a service manual for your Dad's cars, they are $25 or so. That manual has always been my bible for my '51'.

Shorting the end of the plug wire when attached to the plug should give a good indication of the effectiveness of the spark plug and the voltage being fed to the plug. If there is no discernible difference in engine speed then that cylinder is not firing correctly. It could be one of many reasons. Conversely if there is a drop in engine speed then the cylinder is at least operating.

When checking the spark intensity of the wire or spark plug the quality of the ground is a factor. Paint or corrosion at the point where the spark jumps or plug is grounded can be a factor. Also the conductor in the plug wire, condition of the wire ends, how far the wire is pushed into the socket, condition of socket on the cap, condition of the contact on the inside of the cap, crack in the cap can contribute to the observed weak spark.

So.....which cylinder has the weak spark, number one or number six?

Also, if you had a short your amp meter would most likely peg itself on the discharge side of the gauge.

A bad valve will not cause a weak spark. It will cause a miss on that cylinder.

Here's todays update... a step backwards! We took it for a twenty mile drive last night. It ran fine for the first half, and showed a charge on the amps. On the way back I decided to turn the lights on. It started to sound like it was cutting out, or not getting a good spark. It kept running, but was hesitating, and felt different. I drove it home, put it in the garage, and tried to restart it... and it just cranked and wouldn't fire again. Power is down to the coil. Still showing 6+ volts on the battery and the starter. Also, I could hear a valve sticking more... a puffing sound at the exhaust. Or maybe it's not a valve, and it's just that cylinder that's not firing right puking it's gas out?

The firing order in my book shows #1 at the firewall, and #6 at the front of the car. It's #6 that's the weak one.

Oh, and it's a 3 speed, Richard... any ideas where I go from here?

That could be your problem! If your book actually says that the number one cylinder is in the back of the engine then you need to throw your book away! Either that or you might have read the book wrong because if what you said is true then you have the firing order backwards!! The number one cylinder is in the front of the engine next to the radiator and the number six cylinder is at the back of the engine, next to the firewall. Not the other way around! Since you may have your firing order backwards (based on what you said in your post) then your present firing order is 6-2-4-1-5-3.

Starting from the front of the engine the firing order is 1-5-3-6-2-4, with the number one spark plug wire being at the six o'clock position on the distributor cap. Again, the number one cylinder is in the front of the engine and the number six cylinder is in the back of the engine.

Maybe I'm talking out of my butt again! I'll go have a look...

Okay... I had a look. The book says the order is starting from the furthest point (6oclock) on the distributor from the motor, and the order is 1-5-3-6-2-4. I assumed that #1 was against the firewall because that's how it looks when you are standing over the distributor, and if you look back to page one of this thread, you'll see that at 6oclock on my '51 is the plug lead for what I thought was cylinder #1! I'll have to look for mark on the flywheel and set it up again... but I'm pretty sure that if I had it wrong, the car wouldn't run... as all the cylinders would be firing at the bottom of the stroke, right?

Never assume anything or you will get yourself screwed up. As we mentioned to you before, the number one spark plug wire is at the 6 o'clock position on the distributor, which is the tower at the bottom of the distributor next to the inner fender (the same as on a clock). The number one spark plug wire goes from that tower to the number one cylinder which is at the front of the engine. Then, clockwise, the next spark plug wire would go to number 5, which is the fifth cylinder back from the front of the engine and so on. If you don't have your spark plug wires set up in the order described (1-5-3-6-2-4) from the front of the engine to the back then you have it wrong. It is possible to have the wires in the correct order and the distributor 180 degrees out.

If you are in doubt about what you are doing, then you might get a professional mechanic to help you set up the firing order and the timing. Since you apparently have your firing order 180 degrees out, that is no doubt why your plugs are sooty and you can't start the car.

Good luck!

The important thing is that you have everything lined up to run as it is. It looks like you have the distributor 180 off, but the plug wires are where they need to be to do the job.

If you want to get it right, line up the #1 cylinder on compression and the timing mark. Then pull the distributor and turn it 180 degrees and put it back. Watch the rotor as you pull it out, because you want it 180 from the point where it stops turning as you lift the distributor out. Once you've done that, put the cap back on and starting with #1 down at the 6 o'clock position, connect the cables by firing order going clockwise.

Time it, button everything down and take it for a drive. I think the rest of your troubles will go away after a good hard run.

WRONG, number One is at the front of the engine

I don't doubt you guys one bit... It just seems odd to me that they wouldn't mention which cylinder is #1 in the manual! I can't be the only one that's screwed that up before!

So I'm guessing that the '51 has the distributor turned 180 degrees but the plug wires are also turned as well. The car has run perfectly like this for 45+ years that the motor has been in it. I'm not going to mess with it!

I think the '50's distributor has been turned as well, and the wires as well, but they may not be lined up 100%. I'm going to have to get a timing light to set it up properly. My concern is... would that timing being out affect the car on starting the way it is, ie: causing different electrical loads going to the starter and coil? I had it out again today, and it seems to start just fine when it is cool, then back to not starting when it's hot! Putting a direct wire to the coil from the battery makes it fire right up...

As I mentioned before, the distributor doesn't really care what position it's in as long as the plug wires go in the right towers to make up for it and it gets timed right. Your plug wires are in the correct sequence. The timing may be off far enough to make it hard to start when hot, BUT

I really think that you have a problem with your starter. Have you gone to the web page I sent and done the checks on it? It sounds to me like it is drawing too many amps; that problem gets worse when the engine/starter is hot.

I haven't done that yet.... I'm going to do that when I get a whole day to work on it. I'm really kind of against taking it to a mechanic as well. I think it's only getting harder to find ones that know these old cars, so I really want to learn myself. I've learned so much in the last few weeks! That's where you guys come in... Thanks!

Yes.

Also, keep in mind that the valve timing has a relationship to the firing order as well.

You should probably start fresh and then go from there. That is to say, you should have the number one cylinder (which is in front not in the back) on compression stroke, the timing mark lined up with the pointer, the rotor on the distributor pointing to the number one tower on the distributor cap and the firing order 1-5-3-6-2-4 in a clockwise rotation from that point.



The timing chart that I have shows a layout of the cylinders and that the front cylinder is number one. Sounds like you might need more literature on your car.

You would think that the Shop Manual would have such info, but mine for 1940 doesn't. They probably felt that people using the manual would already know such things. I think that when Motors and others started writing aftermarket manuals they went into more detail on such things, because they were writing for other than manufacturer mechanics and laymen. I sure miss my old Motors manual, but that's another thing that disappeared over the years.

So, what manuals do we need for sufficient info on our cars, and where do we get them?

You can never have too many manuals and a variety is even better. I have found that in many cases my Motors manuals give more information than the factory shop manual....for one...the layout order of the cylinders.

Manuals can be purchased on eBay, from the Filling Station, from swap meets, and a really good source would be from literature dealers.

YO Brewster! Got an up date for us yet? I was thinking about your hot start problem. Does it crank okay or sound like the battery is low? Have you tried holding the gas pedal to the floor for a hot restart? It could be a starter problem, timing or carburation.

Let's get this thing fixed for some touring! Or I suppose you might be out there doing that now?

I'm on a bit of a break from it right now. I had the '51 out for a S. Ont. Region tour on Saturday, and the centre distributor-coil wire was shorting. We had to replace it, and Randy Petitt was able to come up with one for me. It was one I swapped over from the convertible last week, so I'm going to make sure that both of them are not bad! I think the next step is going to be get the timing right, and the distributor turned right, to eliminate that as a symptom. Also going so check the valves, as I think one is sticking. Kind of big job type stuff, so I'll need to leave it till I have a couple days off. The town's Fall Fair is next Saturday, and 2 blocks from my house, so I may take it to the car show there next week.