VCCA Home Forums TECHNICAL - 1945 AND EARLIER 1912-1928 Fake Honeycomb Radiator Front for 1927

I am preparing my 27 for a Touring vehicle. My radiator guy had seen a supplier that was selling a honeycomb face to put on a newer radiator core to give the appearance of a orginal 27 radiator. He cannot find the supplier at this time. Are any of you aware of a source of this face?

I have heard of those also but not sure where I saw them. You might try the "Filling Station" althought they may have just listed replacement honey comb cores for big $$$. Radiator guy I talked to a couple months ago said the british had bought all the tooling to do those years ago and have also locked up the market for the thin brass needed to make them and charge big money for new honey comb radiators. I found it hard to belive you can't get brass sheet in any thickness you want, but that is what he said. If someone is making the fake fronts, they are possibly made in Great Britian. Remeber this though, if you use a fake front, the radiator must be thinner than original and fitting in the shell might be a problem. The back of the core may be very close to the fan and moving the radiator and shell forward to clear will make the hood not fit right. Hopefully the new thinner core is efficient enough to cool the engine at high speed or at long idle times (spark retarded) like parades.

Sorry, folks, but there is not a very big profit in the honeycomb cores even now when the prices have gone high. Last autumn the copper etc. for making brass etc. to cores jumped 60% higher than before. It raised the NORS cores from 600 to 1000 USD, due to the world market prices for metals, and still is creeping (or better: running) higher.

As far as I know the prices in England are higher than from suppliers in USA, and including the extra work to make a combination of a fake front and a modern core will really be using money.

You can remove the upper/lower containers and saw through the old core. Let the radiator people fasten that to a modern core, if they accept to do a good job at a usable price. I know it can be done, but you need good tools and you must be precise and patient to obtain a cut through that can be of practical use.

Or you may accept to order the original NORS core (adjusted somewhat to give more cooling) by The Filling Station to get a correct, goodworking radiator which will lift the value of the car as well.

Hope you will find a good solution, but don't wait too long, as the metal prices will go a lot higher.

:vcca:

Honestly, I don't think I would be worried about metal prices going up as I would the companys doing the work going out of business. I sold restoration parts for 64-72 Oldsmobiles internationally from 1987 till 2002 and saw a few corrections in the economy during that time. Each time my phone would almost stop ringing and I would have to take a second job to keep afloat. People just don't spend money on hobbies when things get tight especially if they have mortgages and familys. The economy is way worse now than I ever saw it. Scrap metal prices are in the toilet right now, but they usually get soft this time of year with the ol "end of the 4th business quarter" deal. We will have to wait to see what happens this spring. China has all but quit buying scrap and the domestic companys using metals are laying off workers because orders are way down so new metal prices should follow suite. That is a good idea about sawing off the front of an old radiator, but I can see it would be difficult to do and not fold up the hex holes or get big burrs, May have to use a laser to slice it off, if a laser will work on brass and lead. Some aircraft parts manufacturers do laser machining if you could talk one into doing an old car part. I used to know someone who worked for Allison Gas Turbine now Rolls Royce in Indianapolis who ran a laser machine that cut large shim plates, but he has now retired I am sure. The radiator guy I talked to does mostly very old car radiators. The old square hole type, Honey comb type made from individual tubes soldered together in a frame work, and the thin round brass tube with copper fins pressed together with handmade brass tanks and no shell. He said the Harrison type is just darn near impossible to work with since the old solder crystalizes and corrodes and the Radiator is made up of long vertical strips with the honey comb shape and water tubes made into the strips and dip soldered together while in a clamping frame. I can see his point, It would be very tough to get in the holes to do a repair and not have it come apart right next to the repaired area. He did say something about an epoxy type repair that he has had luck with for getting down inside of the multiple honeycomb shaped holes on Harrisons and is heat tolerant and flexible. If that old radiator would be a candidate for that repair it might be something to look into and a lot cheaper than a new custom core with the false front.

Sorry but I can't help you with a supplier in the USA. However, some 20 years ago I went out in my freshly restored "28" and it boiled badly. The radiator core was supposed to be OK but wasn't. I ended up cracking the block in a rebuilt motor.
I went to a local radiator guy who said that he could not clean up an old honeycomb but offered to slice off about 3/8 inch of honeycomb and mount it in front of a modern core. He did it with a big hand saw and charged me about $200 US all up. That was a long time ago so I suppose we are talking about $400 US today.
Anyway I have happily wandered around since then with few problems despite the fact that Australia tends to be a hot place.
At one stage a fan blade broke and headed off. Of course in a "28" there is a large shroud which directed the blade into the radiator. Because it was a modern core it cost me little to repair. If it had been a honeycomb I would have been in trouble. I actually have about 8 inches clearance between the core and the fan which is 7 1/2 inches more than I have in my "38".
I suppose that it is all about making a decision. Ultimately a radiator is there to cool and if I did it again I would look at what is most efficient. Some people do I what I did, others pay up for a honeycomb, others just put it a modern core and paint it matt black and who notices ?, and others do that and make up a neat chrome plated screen and put it in front.
Ultimately don't stinge on the radiator costs. A cracked block is not cheap to fix.

It might be better to try dealing direct with the makers of the honeycomb cores.
Their details are as follows:

ADRAD NATIONAL RADIATORS
PO BOX 12-570
PENROSE,1642,
NEW ZEALAND.

Ph.No. 0011 or 0018 95792604
Fax.No. 0011 or 0018 95251176

If you ring or fax,ask for Roger Birchall,and he'll give you all the help you need.

As to the radiators covered with grilles in front it is less important to use the original style of cores. But as to all years from the beginning up to 1932 the outlook of a modern radiator will look strange and, in my opinion completely unwanted.

When I got Solan/the 1916 from Australia the core was gone. So I ordered a new of same type here. In 10 days all was OK and the radiator was in again. But unfortunately I did not check if the core was the original type. Instead the core was very near or equal to the T-F**D, and I got bad feelings about all people asking what year my T-F**D was made.

So when I got the message of 60% higher cores from The Filling Station I ordered one at the old price, and finally I avoid many of the former questions about the brand. Many car nuts see the difference between Ts and 490, and even some others too after I changed to the original type. And I am enjoying the style and feeling I have improved the picture of my car, even if it cost me around 1000 bucks. Luckily my wife is helping with the money for the old cars.

As to slice off the core it can be done by a big hand saw. The guy who did it this spring on a big French car, has driven the car all this summer without problems.

At last but not least: Even if the metal prices turns somewhat lower we still will be depending on the present very few "left-over" companies making the old style cores. So if they cannot get enough orders to survive, our old cars with open cores will loose the original style when repairs are needed. A pity and something I do not approve for my cars.

:vcca:

There are quite a few Chev 4's running modern radiator cores with a 3/8" grille cut from an old honeycomb core, down here in Aus. We often have temperatures over 100 degrees. (it's over 100 today) A mate of mine has one in his 28 and it runs so cool he doesn't need a fan blade anymore and from the front it looks like an original honeycomb.
A local bloke does it for around $500 Aus. which is about $350 US. I'm running one of these modern cores (Holden) in my 34 Master and it runs about the same as the original and cost was $320 US
Chris

I got one of the radiators from the Filling Station a couple of years ago for my 24 Superior and have been very satisfied with it. It WAS very expensive, but I figured not keeping the engine cool would cost me more and one of the most striking things about the car is the look of the radiator.

The radiator cores from The Filling Station are very good working and looking as originals. Until autumn last year they cost USD 500,-, but they are now starting at USD 975,-. Still I doubt you can get them lower at most other places with that quality and design.

We are very fortunate to have vendors like TFS willing to supply us with such items at the best possible prices and quality.

:vcca:

hi the brass factory will build you radiator for you but very pricey check the net for the brass
factory and the brass works in californa usa

hi http://www.thebrassworks.net/modela_radiator.aspxits vukie again here is the link

Sorry, but the link does not work for me.

Try this:

http://www.thebrassworks.net/

Arvid