Reproduction Parts for 1916-1964 Chevrolet Passenger Cars & 1918-1987 Chevrolet & GMC Trucks


Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rating: 5
Page 2 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6
m006840 #370063 06/11/16 08:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
Depends on what mixture was used in the process and how "round" it was finished off.


Gene Schneider
Filling Station - Chevrolet & GMC Reproduction Parts


Filling Station


Chev Nut #370142 06/13/16 01:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Ordered a .010 rod just in case. I guess we can ream it to stock if need be. Meanwhile I have asked permission to take 2-3 days off from kitchen cabinet installation to devote to this most important task. She said:"We'll see." Agrin


Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #370143 06/13/16 02:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
If there were shims used when the engine was rebuilt just removing shims to adjust is all that is necessary. Wen new chevrolet allowed .006" in shims for adjustment.
I never heard od resizing an under size for for youe intended use. You will find that if a rod is loose it will probably be only .002" at the most. Any more than that it wwould be really loud.


Gene Schneider
Pat S #373148 08/03/16 05:33 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Originally Posted by Pat S
So here we are almost two years later and the engine still doesn't sound right. Here's a recap:
1-Tried to isolate the noise by shorting out plugs. No noticeable difference.
2-The sharp metallic noise is still there upon startup. I suspect Gene may be right about something rattling on top of a piston.
3-the other day, I took a long (20 miles) "fast" (55 mph) ride and twice while slowing down on the overrun a rapping sound a bit like a hammer drill.
4.the few times I drove it since (abysmal weather) it seems to get worse.

So I plan to open it up.I can check for loose parts in a cylinder by removing the head. I suppose I could check bottom end clearances with plastigage (if it still exists). What about pistons? I guess they'd have to removed and miked?

What I'm looking for is a sequence of elimination starting with the easier test proceeding to a total dismantle if need be. And what should I have on hand just in case?

Would it help if I went for a ride with a passenger equipped with a recording device?

Since that 20 mile drive in the June 10 post it has boiled over everytime I've come back from a drive. As soon as I stop it starts spewing antifreeze. Today, I changed the thermostat, went about seven miles and it did it again. It looks like it was running cooler though, at least on the gauge. Is that overfill coming out or is it actually overheating? Could all that thrashing and knocking be causing it to run hotter? It used to idle endlessly without overheating. Why start out of the blue?

I'm ordering a few pushrods, 216 springs and some tappets. The only tappets I could find were at Kanter ($16.50) and EGGE ($14.17).The rest will come from Bruce Bugay.

Once I've changed those and if there is no difference in the noise that leaves the reciprocating assembly. Then decisions will have to be made. I'll keep you posted. I'm getting pretty sick of this.

Last edited by Pat S; 08/03/16 06:29 PM.

Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #373149 08/03/16 06:54 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 29,848
Tech Advisor
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
Tech Advisor
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 29,848
Did you try removing the thermostat to see what happens?

laugh wink beer2


The Mangy Old Mutt

"If It's Not Junk.....It's Not Treasure!"
Pat S #373150 08/03/16 07:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 19,757
Likes: 62
ChatMaster - 15,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 15,000
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 19,757
Likes: 62
Pat,
Does the loss of coolant start immediately after shutting down the engine or is there a delay of a minute or so? If immediate I highly suspect air getting into the coolant. It does not take much time for the reduction in internal cooling system pressure and heat to expand any air bubbles which pushes out coolant. The likely culprit is the water pump seal(s).

If it is after boil it takes some time for the water to go from liquid to gas (steam). Also if that is the case you should actually hear a bumping or thumping sound coming from the engine.

Of course you know that diagnosis from 3000 miles away is not a 100% science.


How Sweet the roar of a Chevy four!
Chipper #373151 08/03/16 08:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
I can't remember if this has been mentioned but does the engine make the noise with the fan belt removed?


Gene Schneider
Chev Nut #373155 08/03/16 08:49 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Yes. I tried that after my wife said she thought it came from the front.


Best Regards, Pat
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Originally Posted by Junkyard Dog
Did you try removing the thermostat to see what happens?

laugh wink beer2

Not yet.


Best Regards, Pat
Chipper #373157 08/03/16 08:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Originally Posted by Chipper
Pat,
Does the loss of coolant start immediately after shutting down the engine or is there a delay of a minute or so? If immediate I highly suspect air getting into the coolant. It does not take much time for the reduction in internal cooling system pressure and heat to expand any air bubbles which pushes out coolant. The likely culprit is the water pump seal(s).

If it is after boil it takes some time for the water to go from liquid to gas (steam). Also if that is the case you should actually hear a bumping or thumping sound coming from the engine.

Of course you know that diagnosis from 3000 miles away is not a 100% science.

Yes, it is right after shutting down evrytime. Something happening with the water pump could explain the sudden start of this tendency.I'll have to check that. Is it possible to remove the water pump without removing the grille & rad? And where are those seals?


Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #373166 08/03/16 11:16 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
The water pump can be removed wiithout removing the radiator. First remove the fan. When doing so put a piece of cardboard against the radiator core to save your knuckles and the core. It is possible that the baffle in the block behind the water pump has come loose (in the block) and is spinning with the pump impeller.
That would also upset the cooling system.


Gene Schneider
Pat S #373177 08/04/16 07:29 AM
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,149
Likes: 41
ChatMaster - 6,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 6,000
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 6,149
Likes: 41
I am not sure if it has been mentioned before but when heated water will expand and to the extent of approximately half the top radiator tank. With this in mind I rarely fill beyond that level on any system without a recovery tank, saves a big mess and worry.
Tony


1938 1/2 ton Hope to drive it before I retire
tonyw #373179 08/04/16 07:46 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Originally Posted by tonyw
I am not sure if it has been mentioned before but when heated water will expand and to the extent of approximately half the top radiator tank. With this in mind I rarely fill beyond that level on any system without a recovery tank, saves a big mess and worry.
Tony

I was thinking about that everytime I refilled it, but how can you tall when you have enough yet not too much?


Best Regards, Pat
Chev Nut #373181 08/04/16 07:48 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Originally Posted by Chev Nut
The water pump can be removed wiithout removing the radiator. First remove the fan. When doing so put a piece of cardboard against the radiator core to save your knuckles and the core. It is possible that the baffle in the block behind the water pump has come loose (in the block) and is spinning with the pump impeller.
That would also upset the cooling system.

Now, that is a scary proposition. If I remember well that thing is either sheet steel or brass. If it spins it must be junk. Do they sell new ones? Or do they make 3" frost plugs? Also, Gene, when they were saying yesterday the seal of the water pump may be taking air were they talking about the packing behind that castellated nut?


Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #373925 08/18/16 10:48 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
BTT. I need to know about the availability of the baffle before I remove the water pump to check. There is a baffle in my spare engine but I can't figure out how to remove it without damaging it. The 216 springs and pushrods are in from Bruce Bugay. Still waiting on the tappets. Then I'll get at it.


Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #373926 08/18/16 11:08 AM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 29,848
Tech Advisor
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
Tech Advisor
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 29,848
The Filling Station has the water pump baffle plates. Whenever you need any parts always check the Filling Station's catalog since they have a lot of stuff.

laugh wink beer2


The Mangy Old Mutt

"If It's Not Junk.....It's Not Treasure!"
Pat S #373927 08/18/16 11:10 AM
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 19,757
Likes: 62
ChatMaster - 15,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 15,000
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 19,757
Likes: 62
If it is like the '32 the baffle is staked to the block. I have drilled a hole in the center and then used a screw and slide hammer to remove them. Solder, braze or weld the hole shut if you are going to try to reuse the baffle. Probably will also need to flatten it back into shape.


How Sweet the roar of a Chevy four!
Chipper #374023 08/19/16 05:31 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,689
Likes: 21
ChatMaster - 6,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 6,000
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,689
Likes: 21
I doubt it is the water pump.

You may want to just drive it until is expires and then rebuild/over haul it. Or do that now. These old engines are tough. It is hard to break them. Agrin

Charlie computer

Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
OK, I have new 216 springs, new lifters (tappets) and three new pushrods.


[Linked Image from i1176.photobucket.com]

I checked my leftover pushrods (the ones in the engine will look like this)and they are worn to a point as opposed to the new ones. I suppose I should find 9 more.

[Linked Image from i1176.photobucket.com]

Now, I'll need a bit of help in planning this.I read both the GM shop manual and the Motor manual. Both describe changing(installing) the valve springs with the head off. I was hoping to do this with the head on. One guy at a show with a 6 cyl. 55 Pontiac said he did his holding the valves up with compressed air. Is there another way of holding them?

Here's how I was planning to proceed. Looking for advice, corrections, suggestions.
-Remove valve & side covers
-Remove rocker arm assembly.
-Loosen up lifter spring retainer
-Pull up pushrods, springs, lifters .
-Replace same. Is there any harm in leaving lifter springs in place even if I use 216 valve springs?
-Then there is the valve springs. Is there a top & bottom to them?
-Have I forgotten anything?

Regards, Pat




Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #375065 09/08/16 12:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
The push rods ends are not worn. That was a running change made over the yeas. The shape of the seat in the lifter was also changed if I remember correctly.
The close end of the coil goes down.
Remove the helper springs and the hardware....the stronger new springs will be all you need.
A special air fitting is the spark plug hole and compressed air is one way to hold the valves in place. There is a KD tool sold, kind of a lever, to compress the spring and top retiner cap.

Last edited by Chev Nut; 09/08/16 12:14 PM.

Gene Schneider
Chev Nut #375069 09/08/16 12:28 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Originally Posted by Chev Nut
The push rods ends are not worn. That was a running change made over the yeas. The shape of the seat in the lifter was also changed if I remember correctly.
The close end of the coil goes down.
Remove the helper springs and the hardware....the stronger new springs will be all you need.
A special air fitting is the spark plug hole and compressed air is one way to hold the valves in place. There is a KD tool sold, kind of a lever, to compress the spring and top retiner cap.

Thanks Gene. So if the pushrods in the engine are straight, Ican leave them there?


Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #375081 09/08/16 03:01 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
The same guywho told me of holding the valves with air also told me he got rid of his valvetrain noise with EOS, available at GM dealerships. It turns out to be AC Delco Engine Oil Supplement and it says right on the bottle it is for sticky lifters and noisy valve trains. Would it act like MMO & ATF or rather like STP?


Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #375103 09/08/16 06:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
If the push rods are straight they can be used.
GM EOS has been around for years. It originally was used for new engine break-in because it contained a lot of Zink and extra detergent for sticky hydraulic lifters. It is semi-thick. It is no longer used for hyd. lifters because with todays great oils the "sticking" problem no longer exists. It is still recomended by GM for new camshaft break-in.


Gene Schneider
Chev Nut #375165 09/10/16 10:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Pat S Offline OP
ChatMaster - 1,500
OP Offline
ChatMaster - 1,500
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,869
Covers & rocker arms off. Ready to roll.

[Linked Image from i1176.photobucket.com]

[Linked Image from i1176.photobucket.com]


Best Regards, Pat
Pat S #375167 09/10/16 10:51 AM
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
ChatMaster - 25,000
Offline
ChatMaster - 25,000
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,700
Likes: 141
Will be thinking of you.......Good Luck


Gene Schneider
Page 2 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6

Link Copied to Clipboard
Support The VCCA!

Enjoy the forum? Become a VCCA member! The World's Best Chevrolet and GMC Club!


Member Photos
1964 Chevrolet Impala SS
1964 Chevrolet Impala SS
by DreamChevy, February 17
My 1933 Chevy 2 Dr. Sedan
My 1933 Chevy 2 Dr. Sedan
by 1939Chevy1, November 24
Back on the road 79 years later
2 1927 Chevrolet Trucks
2 1927 Chevrolet Trucks
by 1927TRUCKS, June 7
Who's Online Now
1 members (Tiny), 82 guests, and 19 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
NeilA, Jayhicks, Tomvanhouten, Dads29Chevy, Tractorman
18,308 Registered Users
Today's Birthdays
SabrinaKarras, Speedy1
Forum Statistics
Forums58
Topics59,072
Posts429,077
Members18,308
Most Online1,133
Jan 22nd, 2020
 

Notice: Any comments posted herein do not necessarily reflect the official position of the VCCA.

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5